Amps
[Top] [All Lists]

Re: [Amps] IMD and driving power

To: "'Rob & Terri Sherwood'" <rob@sherweng.com>
Subject: Re: [Amps] IMD and driving power
From: "Joe Subich, W4TV" <w4tv@subich.com>
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2008 10:20:53 -0400
List-post: <amps@contesting.com">mailto:amps@contesting.com>
> The Yaesu Mk V in class A, on the other hand is astoundingly clean. 
> http://nc0b.com/documents/NC0B-Contest-U-2008-9.pdf

That's true enough.  Unfortunately, as you also point out in 
your presentation, most transceivers do not offer 24, 32, or 48 
volt amplifiers capable of 200 in class B and 50 to 60 watts in 
class A.  Any amplifier other than a high gain triode like the 
8877 or pair of 3CX800s is going to require more power than 
any of the transceivers can provide in class A to reach 1500 
watts out.     

The example I gave is for the Mark V Field. Even though it has a 
Class A mode, its power is limited to 25 watts - not enough to 
drive even an 8877 to 1500 watts out. 

73, 

   ... Joe, W4TV 
 


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob & Terri Sherwood [mailto:rob@sherweng.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 9:56 AM
> To: Joe Subich, W4TV
> Cc: 'Robert Kirkland'; amps@contesting.com
> Subject: Re: [Amps] IMD and driving power
> 
> 
> The Yaesu Mk V in class A, on the other hand is astoundingly clean. 
> http://nc0b.com/documents/NC0B-Contest-U-2008-9.pdf
> 
> Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
> >
> >   
> >> As a general rule if you can reduce your amp driving power in
> >> half you gain a 3db reduction in the transceiver IMD.
> >>     
> >
> > This is one of those "general rules" that is very wrong when it
> > comes to solid state transceivers.  Almost all modern power 
> > transistors have a "saddle shaped" IMD curve.  When power output 
> > is reduced significantly below the optimum point IMD increases.  
> > If power is increased above optimum IMD increases rapidly.  
> >
> > For example, look at the 2SC2879 used in the Yaesu Mark V Field:
> > http://www.datasheet4u.com/download.php?id=71199.  The IMD 
> vs. Power 
> > Output curves show a "sweet spot" around 55 to 65 watts per 
> transistor 
> > before filter and transformer losses of about -38 dB.  With 
> the losses 
> > in the transformer, lowpass filter and antenna tuner, this 
> represents 
> > just about the transceiver's rated 100 watt output.  
> Decreasing power 
> > to 40 watts per transistor (1.4 dB) increases IMD by more 
> than 6 dB! 
> > Increasing power output to 80 watts per transistor (~1 dB) 
> results in 
> > an 8 dB IMD increase and pushing to 100 watts (~2 dB) per 
> transistor 
> > results in a nearly 14 dB increase in IMD.  
> >
> > If your amplifier requires substantially less drive than your
> > transceiver produces you are better off using an attenuator on 
> > its input rather than reducing the drive in the transceiver. 
> >
> > 73,
> >
> >    ... Joe, W4TV
> >  
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >   
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: amps-bounces@contesting.com
> >> [mailto:amps-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Robert Kirkland
> >> Sent: Sunday, August 31, 2008 9:04 AM
> >> To: amps
> >> Subject: [Amps] IMD and driving power
> >>
> >>
> >> As a general rule if you can reduce your amp driving power in
> >> half you gain 
> >> a 3db reduction in the transceiver IMD. Less in, less out. 
> Bob,w5pvr 
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Amps mailing list
> >> Amps@contesting.com 
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/amps
> >>     
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Amps mailing list
> > Amps@contesting.com 
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/amps
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > If this email is spam, report it here:
> > 
> http://www.onlymyemail.com/view/?action=reportSpam&Id=ODA2MTI6
NzMyNzg2NDgxOnJvYkBzaGVyd2VuZy5jb20%3D
>
>
>   

_______________________________________________
Amps mailing list
Amps@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/amps

<Prev in Thread] Current Thread [Next in Thread>