Amps
[Top] [All Lists]

Re: [Amps] Defining CCS

To: amps@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [Amps] Defining CCS
From: "Roger (K8RI)" <k8ri@rogerhalstead.com>
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2018 02:30:24 -0500
List-post: <mailto:amps@contesting.com>
I'd need to look it up to be sure, but IIRC, exposure levels are calculated as a 5 minute period of transmission between two 5 minute off periods. Out of that, CW is considered 50% duty cycle and unprocessed SSB is considered 20%

As CW is the most demanding at 50% (neglecting digital @100%), I'd think that would be considered to be ICAS. Amps rated at 100% ICAS for the legal limit, are incapable of running digital at their full ratings. An amp capable of running a 5 minute digital transmission needs substantial overhead compared to SSB and CW. Depending on the thermal mass of the tube and the capability of the PS, I "would think" most amps capable of a 5 minute digital transmission would need to be close to CCS capable.

That PS, not only needs to be capable of supplying the voltage and current, but the core needs to be capable of a reasonable temperature rise and the ability to stay within that designed temperature range with a prolonged use (contesting).  IOW, 12 to 24 hours, or more, at the equivalent of that 5 off, 5 on, 5 off, cycle.

73, Roger (K8RI)


On 12/31/2017 Sunday 6:43 PM, Jim Thomson wrote:
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2017 08:55:57 +0700
From: Charles Harpole <hs0zcw@gmail.com>
To: amps@contesting.com
Subject: [Amps] Defining CCS

<Ok, I have had it with vague sales statements.  The following was used
since at least 1955 and all amp experts know it.

CCS is Continuous Commercial Service.  This is true 100% duty cycle, BRICK
ON THE KEY, rating indicating operations for 24/7/365 with no off times.
No sales talk juggling.

ICAS is Intermittent Commercial and Amateur Service.  That means typical
on-and-off ham operations without long key-down transmissions (usually 10
minutes is called long).  This is NOT 100% duty cycle but indicates use of
full power with limited key-down times and definite key-up times.

An amp can be called 100% ICAS by imaginative advertising writers, but that
number is definitely not CCS.

It is helpful to hold to old established nomenclature for clear
communication.
?73?

Charly, HS0ZCW

## agreed.   IMO,    CCS=100% duty cycle means  24/7/365  brick on key, dead 
cxr.
ICAS  is a 50% duty cycle.  Processed  ssb is no where near 50%.   Then Bill 
orr started up the..
IVS nonsense,  intermittent voice service, non processed  ssb.   Terms like... 
100%  ICAS is
plane misleading..and fubar at best.

##  Art Bell, W6OBB came in one day and  found his alph 89 on fire.  His  cat 
had fallen asleep on the
footswitch.  Art had it tweaked up to run 1.5 kw out FM  on 10M band..into a 
flat swr.   Art phones Alpha
tech.  Tech tells Art not to believe the advertising hype.   Dunno if he had 
the optional fan on the rear apron or not.
The 10M portion of the PI-L had turned to glop.

##  IMO, both alpha +  OM power are using too small a diameter for their tubing 
coils.  The lower band torroids run way too hot.
Buddy with the Emtron amp, he points the IR point and shoot gun at the torroid, 
and they were sitting at a whopping 224 deg C !
Thats with a dead cxr.

##  Alpha 9500 uses a plate xfmr thats touted as 3.5 kva CCS..and only weighs  
30 lbs.  I call BS on that, perhaps  3.5 kva  ICAS.
No way in hell ur gonna get 3.5 kva  CCS from any 30 lb flyweight xfmr, cant be 
done, even in hypersil tape wound and high eff.
A 46 lb dahl is only good for 2.7 to 2.8 kva CCS.

##  melting solder on tank coil taps ?   Dont solder em in the 1st place..or 
use correct size tank coils that dont heat up.
The way to deal with heat is to...not generate it in the 1st place, or minimize 
it.   I wrap the  cu strap around the tubing coils,
then a single machine screw assy cinches the tap up super tight.   Taps made 
with cu strap.   Machine screwed at the band switch.

## The story about alpha running 60 wpm dits, or in some cases, pulse tuning 
with a 25%  duty cycle is well known.   Their excuse, as
told to me was.... they would have blown the breaker, not enough power, 240 vac 
line waaaay too long, no 240 available, etc, etc.

##  Now it all gets worse with the latest crop of SS  wonderbar amps.  SPE amps 
use 3 x different voltages, like 48-50 vdc, then down to
42 vdc, then lower still to 36 vdc.   For power levels of < 1500 watts,   <1000 
watts,  < 500 watts  respectively.   They will auto switch to a lower
voltage if running lower PO..thats to keep the eff high, like back up to a max 
of 50%.   Run a 1.5 kw ss amp at just 750 watts, and eff drops to
a lousy 35% every time, IF same higher vdc used.

##  But SPE now claims NOT to used  processed  SSB when using 1.5 kw pep 
out..or the amp will kick itself down to the 42 vdc level, and tweak ur alc,
and /or insert attenuation padS in series with the drive from the xcvr....such 
that amp is now 1 kw or less.    The SPE  wont handle 10 wpm cw at 1.5 kw
either, kicks down to 1 kw mode.   Dashes at 10 wpm, or less, with a  3:1   or 
4:1   dash-dot ratio  will increase  short term duty cycle.
50%  duty cycle is a time averaged thing.  1 hr on and 1 hr off and 1 hr on  
etc, is also a 50% duty cycle, but the amp will blow its brains out 1st.
SO we can safely assume the SPE is not rated for..... 40%  ICAS..which is all 
CW is anyway !

##  Flex and its power genius is another doozy with its...  100%  ICAS rating.  
   I assume they mean it will actually run at 6-10 wpm ?    Their u tube
video depicts  a myriad of fanS screaming in the background as soon as they 
start sending qsk cw.  On qsk cw, you have cut off the idle current between
dots and dashes.

##  Dunno if the myriad of LP filters in these SS amps  would even handle a 
real CCS rating.   Ditto with final SS pa, and power supply, etc, etc.

## The fellow in VE6 land who builds the superb band pass filters also offers  
several fan options to cool em.   No fan, low speed fan, high speed fan etc.

##  For  $7000.00  for the flex unit, and huge $$  for the  SPE  etc, then toss 
in the required, optional  megabuck auto ant tuner....and  you are into it for a
lotta $$$..esp if you reside outside of the USA.   Toss in the lousy IMD, and 
you are being sold a ... bill of goods imo.   Run the SS amp at low power and 
imd improves,
but eff goes to hell.  But since they auto drop the vdc to a lower level to 
increase the eff, the IMD drops back to lousy.   -30 dbc is nuts these days.

##  The pre-distortion concept works..up to a point, the pre-distortion loop is 
not wide enough.  IMD3 and IMD5 drop like a rock, but IMD7 and IMD9 only drop 
10 db.
IMD11  through IMD19  dont get any benefit or improvement at all, in fact they 
get worse.   The only xcvr with the pre-distortion is the apache line up. And 
their
latest  8000 LDE is only –30dbc, with pre-distortion dis-engaged and running 
only 80 watts out on 40m.   So much for the touted  LDMOS devices.

##  None of my hb tube amps runs hot, they will all run 100%  CCS  key down.  
Pretty simple to pull that off, just use the correct sized components to begin 
with.
Added cost is not much more.  Long term reliability is greatly enhanced, they 
just run and run, nothing to blow up or overheat.  IMD is superb.   -59db IMD3 
is
superb, then it just gets better for the higher order products...and no 
pre-distortion used.    A  1 tube GG triode is pretty simple.  Just a tuned 
input,
PI net kw output, a few meters for grid, plate, and B+, and TR relays etc, and 
a box.  B+  supply is dead simple.   Simple to trbl shoot if required.
A  $500.00  chinese  8877 is a bargain. Ditto with a chinese  3CX-3000A7.


##  They should be using 4 of those new fangled  50 /63 vdc  LDMOS devices.   
At 1.5  to 2.0 kw out, they would be very clean IMD wise.
end of rant

Jim   VE7RF
_______________________________________________
Amps mailing list
Amps@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/amps


--
Roger (K8RI)


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


_______________________________________________
Amps mailing list
Amps@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/amps
<Prev in Thread] Current Thread [Next in Thread>