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Subject: Power
Date: Fri Jul 15 14:39:12 1994
I was amused that in the middle of all this discussion about running excess
power, there was a posting which referred to the "ON4UN mod" to the FT1000
which prevents you from smoking the sub-receiver when it is attached to a
separate antenna. How appropriate.
Dave G4BUO


>From K9VV - Fred Kleber <0006636049@mcimail.com>  Fri Jul 15 13:40:00 1994
From: K9VV - Fred Kleber <0006636049@mcimail.com> (K9VV - Fred Kleber)
Subject: NI6T Summary
Message-ID: <71940715124017/0006636049PK3EM@mcimail.com>

In a word - BRAVO!  Now where should I send that shipment of 8877's you
ordered?  (Just kidding Garry...)

Fred Fubar, k9vv@mcimail.com

>From gchristianson@pppl.gov (George Christianson)  Fri Jul 15 15:10:51 1994
From: gchristianson@pppl.gov (George Christianson) (George Christianson)
Subject: Big Power
Message-ID: <199407151310.JAA10391@pppl.gov>

>        K1DG wrote:
>        > I will now confess to  using high power in a contest. Once.
>        If this was such an ethical conundrum, why didn't you just turn 

         AA5BT wrote:
>I now freely confess that I drove at 101 mph for a few seconds
>in the 70s out in west TX at night.  Phew, I feel better now.
>Derek AA5BT, G3NMX
         OK, guys:  I confess that I recently went into a diner and ordered
and ate a SOFT-BOILED EGG for breakfast, and on July 4th in the evening, my
daughter & I set off SPARKLERS in the back yard.  (Believe it or not, both
activities are illegal in the Police State of New Jersey).  God, I feel
                                    George, NJ2P
George B. Christianson         | INTERnet: gchristianson@pppl.gov
Princeton University            |
Plasma Physics Laboratory  | Phone:    (609)-243-3270     FTS: 340-3270
P. O. Box 451                        | Amateur Radio: NJ2P
Princeton, NJ 08543 USA     | 

>From drs@ccd.harris.com (Doug Snowden)  Fri Jul 15 14:31:21 1994
From: drs@ccd.harris.com (Doug Snowden) (Doug Snowden)
Subject: Ground Plane Height
Message-ID: <9407151331.AA389851@rs2>

I have used a ground plane on 40 meters for a couple of years with
very good results. It is elevated only 20 ft and has 8 radials drooping
from the base. I had this same antenna elevated about 12 ft at one time 
and it seemed that it actually performed better there - I'm not sure
though. My question is: Is there any information out there on what
height off the ground you need to be for the radials to start looking 
like the ground? I think I could manage to get an 80 meter ground plane
up 15-20 ft (maybe). By the way, I am talking about fullsize 1/4 wavenlength
antennas, not loaded ones. Another question: would it be possible for a
50 ft (or so) top loaded vertical to work well on 160m in a ground plane
configuration? Say, elevated also about 20 ft.

BTW, the reason I think I was happier with the 40 meter ground plane at
a lower height is because the radials were more horizontal, giving me 
closer to 50 ohm match. Probably didn't actually radiate better.

Thanks, Doug, N4IJ   drs@ccd.harris.com

>From barry@w2up.wells.com (Barry Kutner)  Fri Jul 15 13:00:26 1994
From: barry@w2up.wells.com (Barry Kutner) (Barry Kutner)
Subject: Thrust bearing centration
Message-ID: <FF5HPc2w165w@w2up.wells.com>

Randy A Thompson <K5ZD@world.std.com> writes:

> How could you possibly need more lateral force "protection" than a 
> standard 2" thrust bearing gives?
> I predict you will have a very difficult time getting two thrust bearings 
> and a rotor all aligned.  Two of them is easy, that third one will be tough.
> On my tower, I have a thrust bearing at the top.  Then just a rotor plate 
> down about 3 ft, then a rotor down another 5 feet.  The purpose of the 
> second rotor plate is to help keep things straight during installation or 
> when I need to pull the rotor.
> Good luck.
> Randy, K5ZD
> On Fri, 15 Jul 1994, Barry Kutner wrote:
> > I am planning on adding a second thrust bearing a few feet below the one 
> > at the top of the tower to lessen lateral forces on the rotor.
> > I plan on mounting the TB3 (Rohn 45) on a Rotor plate. Does anyone have 
> > any tips how to make sure it is centered prior to drilling the new holes?
> > I suppose installing it and drilling it up on the tower is one approach, 
> > but prefer to drill on terra firma. Tnx de Barry
> > 
> > 
> > --=====================================================================
> > Barry N. Kutner, W2UP       Usenet/Internet: barry@w2up.wells.com
> > Newtown, PA                 Packet Radio: W2UP @ WB3JOE.#EPA.PA.USA.NA
> >                             Packet Cluster: W2UP >K2TW (FRC)
> > .......................................................................
> > 
> > 

Randy - I have a 20 ft mast with about 8 ft down in the tower at the 
moment. I am getting interactions between my TH7 and 402CD and want to 
put a few more feet between them.
If you think of the mast as a vertical see-saw, and the thrust bearing at 
the top of the tower as the pivot point, all lateral (tilting) forces 
generated by wind load are tansmitted to the rotor.

Since I will be increasing the moment-arm by extending the mast above the 
thrust bearing, addtional force on the rotor concerns me. Putting a 
second (not third) thrust bearing a few feet above the rotor will absorb 
this force.

Makes sense to me. If I'm missing something, let me know... 73 Barry

Barry N. Kutner, W2UP       Usenet/Internet: barry@w2up.wells.com
Newtown, PA                 Packet Radio: W2UP @ WB3JOE.#EPA.PA.USA.NA
                            Packet Cluster: W2UP >K2TW (FRC)

>From Dave Pascoe <pascoe@MathWorks.Com>  Fri Jul 15 14:51:36 1994
From: Dave Pascoe <pascoe@MathWorks.Com> (Dave Pascoe)
Subject: was: IARU Score - 9V1ARU (now W5WMU power)
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9407150920.B29000-0100000@zippy>

On Thu, 14 Jul 1994, Mr. Class, Randy A Thompson wrote:

> Hmmm...
> I have noticed that KM3T has had some succes in contesting from a few 
> locations.  He usually does really well in contests that require working 
> Europeans.  Since he works so many, I am just really, really sure that he 
> must be running high power.

> How else could he work so many?
> In the recent VHF contest, Dave was doing 6m.  Even though he missed 
> several hours, he still had one of the best scores in the contest.  How 
> could he get this advantage on VHF?  Maybe he broke a bunch of calls and 
> got some extra QSOs that way.  Yeah, that must be it.
> I have always wondered about Dave.  Is he a good operator, just lucky or 
> something else...?
> Sorry to throw stones at your glass house Dave.  I don't believe any of 
> the above allegations are true.  But by making my speculation publicly, I 
> am not doing anything different than your classless allegations against 
> W5WMU.

But what's your point Randy?  You didn't make one.

Sure, my allegation may have been unfounded.  I've never been to W5WMU's 
station.  I didn't have to.  I have a pretty keen knowledge of HF 
propagation phenomena combined with lots of on-the-air experience.
I believe top contesters, even without the theoretical knowledge of 
propagation, know what's going on around them (propagation wise).  They 
know where the band is open to and they know what kind of range of 
signal strengths to expect, given the strengths of others on the band 
from similar geographic regions.  

Is this perfect?  No.  Does this mean W5WMU was surely running very high 
power?  No.  Nothing's perfect, Randy.  

But sometimes we have to shake up the troops in order to get some 
useful discussion going.  That was part of the reason for my message and 
my tone.  I've never been one to slam others without a reason.

It seems that only Dave (WX3N) and perhaps a few others have addressed 
the real issue here.

What if W5WMU really does run very high power?  Just because he lives in 
a "propagationally disadvantaged" area, does this give him the right to 
be 6 dB louder in Europe on the low bands than his peers in 4 and 
5-land?  I don't think so.

True, he's got probably the most impressive set of antennas I have ever 
heard or seen.  I was floored and impressed when I read that.  And it 
makes me think he doesn't run as much power as I originally thought.  But 
people are allowed to speculate in a forum like this.

Only through peer pressure will we stop the kinds of things that we all 
have agreed at one time or another are ethically wrong.

> My experience is that W1's can't understand why anyone would run high 
> power (after all, they don't need it).  My experience is also that most 
> ops, even the I-never-run-power ones, will do it if they can.  Much of 
> their "religous zeal" against power is only because they don't have it 
> available for themselves.

Sounds like whining to me.  Why did you move back to W1-land?  So you 
could have an advantage in DX contests.  At least that's a legal 
and ethically acceptable reason.  There still remains no excuse to run 
illegal power in contests.

Hey, if you really want to win, guest op from an area or station where 
you could win from.  You know how to do that, Randy.  So do most of us.  
But still, running high power is ethically wrong, not to mention against 
FCC Rules and Regulations.

If W5WMU truly doesn't run very high power, my apologies to him.

-Dave KM3T

>From terwill@leotech.MV.COM (Paul Terwilliger)  Fri Jul 15 12:49:17 1994
From: terwill@leotech.MV.COM (Paul Terwilliger) (Paul Terwilliger)
Subject: Big Power
Message-ID: <znr774272957k@leotech.mv.com>

>From K1DG:

> I guess it was a combination of things. The station owner was real proud of 
> his amp (it was homebrew), and wanted me to use it. I was curious to see
> what it was like, since I had never done power before.
> DG

Yes, but did you inhale?

Paul, NX1H

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