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To: cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] N6TJ AXIOMS OF LIFE
From: Barry <w2up@comcast.net>
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 18:41:45 -0600
List-post: <cq-contest@contesting.com">mailto:cq-contest@contesting.com>
I disagree. Some of the big USA multiops have excellent operators.  Some 
have mediocre and poor operators.  Some jump on a new packet spot as 
soon as it hits their screen and throw in their call before they listen 
for anything.  For all they know, they may transmitting at the same time 
as the DX station.  Maybe they get lucky and get in and out before the 
hoards descend.  That's their goal.  I can name calls, but I won't.  I 
can name a few who I've never heard do this - K3LR, W3LPL, and K1AR..  
These guys know who they are, hide behind the call of the multi and 
remain lids, but incognito under the guise of the multi call..
Barry W2UP

Paul Mackanos wrote:
> Here is the problem that I see from your end, and there are no flames
> intended.
> The first thing I will comment about is the BIG USA multi-op stations kept
> calling, completely ignoring what I was sending. Well, first of all remember
> this, if you are one of the operators in a BIG USA multi-op station, I can
> assure you that you are in the category of "one of the best of the best". If
> not, you would not be in one of the chairs at these BIG USA multi-op
> stations. There is no secret to why they always finish at the top of the
> heap. GREAT Operators! Experienced operators! Great teamwork! Etc.etc.etc.
> I am fortunate enough to be one of the ops in a BIG USA Multi-op, and I
> remember the many, many, many busted spots on you. Here is what happens,
> everyone sees the busted spot, but may not immediately know it is busted,
> maybe the band is just getting ready to open to Asia and a BY2 is a
> possibility. (In case you don't know it, the BIG USA multi-ops have
> equipment, antennas, operators, etc that can hear stations that other
> stations cannot hear. (If you can't hear them, you cannot work them!) That
> being said, the multiplier station will go to all spots and check them out.
> The BIG USA multi-op stations are not worrying about being beat out in a
> pile-up, they know they are loud, and at worst, they may have to wait in
> line for 4 or 5 calls to work you, yeh, believe it or not, we can hear the
> other BIG USA multi's calling you) they are loud and they know it. We are
> loud and we know it.
> Here is the problem, and I will cut and paste your own quoted words from
> below: 
> "ID more often, 
> "I remember one busted spot on me where I tried IDing more often"
> Humm?? What happened to IDing after every QSO? The BIG BOYS can copy your
> call and know the difference between a BY2A/6Y2A etc. but only if you take
> the time to ID.
> Listen to every single BIG USA multi-op station on their run frequency,
> every one of them ID's on every QSO, I repeat EVERY QSO, did you read that
> "ID on EVERY QSO". The BIG USA multi-op stations do not have your problem,
> WHY, they ID on every QSO!!
> But when you go on and on and on, and don't respond to me (or other BIG USA
> Multi's) sending ur call? Ur call? (AND I know I am loud, you are 20 over
> and I am pointing 6 over 6 over 6 at you at full legal limit, and you don't
> send your call back, I look at it this way:
> You get what you deserve, don't blame it on anyone but yourself. You are in
> such a hurry to save time and keep that rate up, that you forget about the
> poor guy that wants to work you. If the BIG BOYS can't get you to send your
> call, live with it, stop complaining and log the DUPES.
> Oh yeh, if you need to QRS to below 20 WPM, you are definitely not talking
> about the BIG USA multi station Operators, I believe most of them can copy
> at least 40-50 and higher WPM huh? 
> 90% of your whole problem would have been averted if you had simply ID'd
> after every QSO.
> I really find it funny when anyone beats up the BIG USA multi-op stations,
> you just don't have a clue. We are having fun, laughing and having a great
> time because we know this one great fact - all of the BIG USA multi-op
> stations know this - we have fun because it's "ONLY A HOBBY".
> Paul K2DB
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kenneth Silverman [mailto:kenny.k2kw@gmail.com] 
> Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 4:41 PM
> To: cq-contest@contesting.com
> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] N6TJ AXIOMS OF LIFE
>>> They're happy, and I'm left with a DUPE.  Wonderful.  My only solution
>>> then
>>> is to QSY.  Then watch the DUPES disappear (for awhile, at least)
>> ONLY if you DON'T have the skill to know how to deal with it... ID more
>> often, call a couple CQ's with your call 2 or 3 times, and just work the
>> dupes that don't listen and get them out of the way... while adding a
>> comment about what your real call is again.
> I remember one busted spot on me where I tried IDing more often, QRS to 20
> WPM, kept sending my call, but the same BIG USA multi-op stations kept
> calling, completely ignoring what I was sending.  The problem is not only
> the casual ops - the problem of not listening extends to the highest level
> of stations.  In this particularly bad event (busted packet pileup), I QRS'd
> to 15-20 WPM, kept sending my call, but the same big-gun USA stations kept
> calling.  When that didn't get them to listen I QRQ'd and worked them.
> Jim, in the data I've looked at the dupe rate doesn't appear to be impacted
> significantly by busted spots.  It appears to be the average DX chaser who's
> not calling in a busted packet pileup that's not using computer logging,
> doesn't use dupe check, or typed in the call incorrectly the first/second
> time etc.  Mostly I believe they are honest mistakes made by the multitude
> you want calling in the first place.  For most of the Team Vertical
> operations, dupe rates have been in the 4-6% range regardless of the op,
> style of operating or the number of times the call is sent.
> 73, K2KW
> aka BY2A/6Y2A etc
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Barry Kutner, W2UP             Lakewood, CO

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