Whomever said that the comments on the performance of the Orion should be
limited to those who have actually touched one--is profound. I totally
agree. I put NO faith or credibility in any comments from anyone who is
commenting on someone's else's opinions who also may not have ever seen an
Orion, and even less in those that rise up to defend the heresay...as if it
were credible to begin with.
I have mine..therefore I will comment. I have been a happy SO2R, two
loaded/Inrad mod/ 1000MP user for a long time. In fact, one of my radios was
the exact radio that QST product reviewed and one is a recent model. I
tested the receiver of the Orion against the MP in a side by side test and
the Orion blew away the MP--hands down. Two stations mid qso had guy come in
within a kc and the two stations could not continue and had to move. Before
they did, I adjusted the PBT/BW on the Orion and the offender was GONE. I
mean GONE--but the beauty was that the existing QSO was still great copy
with good audio, no degration to speak of. The MP CANNOT do this. I then
tried the same on CW with two signals literally right on top of each other.
Again, the Orion totally separated them with no loss in copy of either. I
could PBT between them and on each..the other was totally gone. I did this
one whole evening just to see the capabilities--every time I was shocked
with the Orions receiver. I have not had the time to explore all of the
capabilities of this rig but so far I am just blown away with its design,
learning curve and the PERFORMANCE.
I can say positively that after handling the Orion/MP side by side,
comparing the terrific menu access (the quickest,simpliest,easiest) I have
ever seen---to the 1000MP that...well, I hate to disparage one of my true
loves (MP) but it feels like a toy compared to the Orion. When you hear of
"menu" changes it is NOT holding down several buttons, spinning dials to
certain numbers, turning dials to more numbers. A couple of seconds using
the screen display is all it takes--incredibly well designed.
The "BEAUTY" of the Orion that some of you are missing entirely is the fact
that it IS a work in process. That it may NEVER be completely done. I hope
it is never, ever done. Bugs, updates, software developments---YES! Yes!
Bring'em on. I love this ever evolving technology.
When you buy the MP, Pro or anything else, stick in your filters---you're
done. That's it. Stuck with a limited capability box. Anything else has to
be outboard gear all over the place. You have zip/nada ability to improve
anything about your rig--except to buy the next version--then the
next---etc. My Orion is evolving while the others are stuck in the mud
trying to catch up...for lack of a better picture.
I see this much as when TR Log came out. It was kind of like watching the
Muppets. No matter what was discussed or improved as time passed, there were
always the two grouches in the balcony who found no good in anything. The
naysayers got so bad on the TR reflector that I had to unsubscribe. BUT, the
fact is that regardless of dozens or hundreds of updates, it constantly
evolves and gets better. I much prefer that to being stuck in the rut with
hardware or software that is not evolving....which is the same thing as
preplanned obsolesce, compliments of the big three offshore radio
manufacturers. They are going to hate the Orion. Lets see--to improve they
have to build another radio---Orion just downloads....love it.
So while some are hanging outboard eq's/dsp's/receive eq's/blinking lights
and toilets and who knows whatever else to a limited capability box, and
while the grouches are spewing grouch chunks on everyone, the Orion will be
downloading, evolving and keeping one step ahead of the also rans for a long
long time.
Oh, as far as a being a "positive only" Ten Tec obsessive and blindly loyal
zealot--this is the only piece of Ten Tec gear that I own. But considering
the recent service at a prominent amp manufacturer-- and then the wonderful
folks I have dealt with at Ten Tec, there may be a new Titan on the shelf
here soon. Thanks to all the guys at Ten Tec who have had the incredible
foresight to design such a terrific product. 73, Tommy WD4K
-----Original Message-----
From: tentec-bounces@contesting.com
[mailto:tentec-bounces@contesting.com]On Behalf Of
tentec-request@contesting.com
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2003 11:01 AM
To: tentec@contesting.com
Subject: TenTec Digest, Vol 4, Issue 22
Send TenTec mailing list submissions to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of TenTec digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Orion heartache
2. Re: Orion heartache (Jim Reid)
3. An oops in my reply about Orion heartache (Jim Reid)
4. Re: Orion heartache
5. Ten-Tec User Links (Dale L Martin)
6. Re: Orion heartache (Ten-Tec Inc. Amateur Radio Sales)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 22:22:36 -0500
From: nq5t@attbi.com
To: tentec@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Orion heartache
Message-ID: <3E949D2C.19569.154DEE6@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <015e01c2ff01$bb330b50$0401a8c0@PS>
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Message: 1
> But no useful purpose is
> served by the misguided efforts of a few who would see nothing but
> words of praise on this reflector. We learn, and Ten Tec will learn,
> from errors and omissions - this reflector should be a welcome forum
> for balanced technical and performance discussions, positive and
> negative, not a censored platform for presenting only one viewpoint.
Couldn't agree more. At least it is possible to update this radio as
issues are uncovered, as opposed to waiting for the next new one
that must be purchased.
Misguided? I have spent many many hours working with Ten-Tec to
document and resolve items that I found to be issues and problems.
You won't find those things on the reflector. Public moaning and
grumbling doesn't benefit anyone. You'll find my issues and those
of others fixed in the software updates. I didn't have to wait for the
Pro IV (no specific brand implied).
> For example, a number of new owners have commented upon the
> random pinning of the S-meter for no apparent reason.
I don't believe this is a "design decision". It will probably be fixed. It
doesn't "pin", but it is disconcerting. Most likely some DSP artifact.
> Either your radio was a remarkable exception
> or many new ORION users have just not yet gained the familiarity with
> the system that you have.
I can guarantee that isn't the case. It's one opinion.
> Given time, the ORION may yet become
> the radio it was intended to be. Let's all hope so!
George, you really need to buy one ... you might find yourself
unexpectedly surprised. Dump that offshore junk :-)
------------------------------
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 19:01:38 -1000
From: "Jim Reid" <jimr.reid@verizon.net>
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Orion heartache
Message-ID: <000e01c2ff1e$67f66d20$be344104@NewOne>
References: <3E949D2C.19569.154DEE6@localhost>
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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Reply-To: tentec@contesting.com
Message: 2
> > Given time, the ORION may yet become
> > the radio it was intended to be. Let's all hope so!
Aloha,
Not precisely sure which of the commenters wrote the above
lines.
However, no one has as yet commented about the primary
design focus for the Orion. Which is, absolute superior dynamic
range! Or, very high IP3 performance. Or, yet again, superior
performance during very crowded band conditions. The rest of
the many features discussed so far are just cream on the cake
for me, hi. Of course such performance features also translate
into extreme linear operation during "ordinary" QSO situations,
and I love clean audio, be it CW or SSB.
Dynamic range is the reason for the various design features
of this rig: the front end filters, the front end pre-amp design,
the front end ham band only preselectors for the main rcvr,
the IF frequency design plan, the LO1 power output (high) to
drive the first mixer, etc., etc. These are the NEW features
of the Orion design which I believe were the goals of at least
Doug Smith to actualize. At least those are the items about
which I read in his postings, and QEX articles of the past
year or so.
Those features will or will not benefit the "big gun" DX'ers and
contest operators, or they won't! That will eventually decide
the BIG fate of the Ten Tec Orion. Certainly not how many
Hz or kHz per degree of knob twist the rig tunes!! Nor for that
matter of the other items criticized here at.
Sensitivity is not an issue; selectivity is an issue. Separabiltiy
from one signal to another is the big issue in crowded bands.
And all the other NEAT features about the multiple antennas,
separate amps per antenna, etc. Those and operator "usability"
in real situations are what will make me pleased and desire to
keep the radio once in is out here on this island.
At least that seems to be what I am looking forward to realizing when
my Orion finally gets here, hi.
And, I actually plan to operate my Orion using the software
control that N4PY, Carl Moreschi will eventually develop and
continue to improve! I probably won't even be using the front
panel buttons and knobs for more than a couple of months until
Carl has his applications ready, hi. His certainly is wonderful
for the Pegasus/RX-340 set up I had here, until turning in the
Peg in trade toward the Orion, hi. Still using Carl's software
to operate the Orion (and the number of Hz per knob turn is
different with Carl's software than the number using the barefoot
340!).
Just thoughts during a VERY rainy Wednesday night here in
KH6 land.
73, Jim KH7M
------------------------------
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 19:08:26 -1000
From: "Jim Reid" <jimr.reid@verizon.net>
To: "Jim Reid" <jimr.reid@verizon.net>, <tentec@contesting.com>
Subject: [TenTec] An oops in my reply about Orion heartache
Message-ID: <001501c2ff1f$3b479050$be344104@NewOne>
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Message: 3
I typed:
> Still using Carl's software to operate the Orion (and the number
> of Hz per knob turn is different with Carl's software....
Since I do not yet have an Orion, in the above line I meant
to type that I use Carl's software everyday controlling my
Ten Tec RX-340.
73, Jim KH7M
------------------------------
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 01:02:02 -0500
From: nq5t@attbi.com
To: tentec@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Orion heartache
Message-ID: <3E94C28A.23668.7E3D9A@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <000e01c2ff1e$67f66d20$be344104@NewOne>
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Reply-To: tentec@contesting.com
Message: 4
>
> > > Given time, the ORION may yet become
> > > the radio it was intended to be. Let's all hope so!
> However, no one has as yet commented about the primary
> design focus for the Orion. Which is, absolute superior dynamic
> range! Or, very high IP3 performance. Or, yet again, superior
> performance during very crowded band conditions.
This all seems to have been missed in discussions concerning the
color of the display, ad nauseum on tuning step rates, and whether
the Orion is "milspec"or not (all vastly important of course). The
"may yet become" comment, of course, is by someone who "was
told" yada yada.
Everyone has their priorities -- tuning rates, knob turning by electric
motor to see what happens if a control is turned at 5 rpm for 4 hours
clockwise (ok, my sarcasm is coming through), promotion of other
brands (seems to be a trend) , whatever ....
With an exception or two, the guys doing the sniping don't own an
Orion, have never seen one (ok, digital image excepted), and never
listened to one. They're waiting for the next radio from Brand X in
the hopes of retaining bragging rights. They may -- but I have to
ask whether it will change my life? Is the Orion perfect (whatever
that means to me or you)? Of course not. Is it getting better by the
firmware release? Yes.
And think S-E-R-V-I-C-E. You know what that is, unless you've
been living with one of those "other" radios ....
It's all a waste of internet bits. The Orion (even though it may not
be perfect) is a mity-fine radio.
(for the record, the Orion has not yet hit my AMEX bill, and I am still,
as are we all, in the 30-day window, so I'm not just trying to
rationalize my expenditure)
Grant
------------------------------
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:11:32 -0500
From: "Dale L Martin" <kg5u@hal-pc.org>
To: "Ten-Tec Reflector" <tentec@contesting.com>
Subject: [TenTec] Ten-Tec User Links
Message-ID: <LPBBJJHKFOOEGKEBKHOJCEKJENAA.kg5u@hal-pc.org>
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Reply-To: tentec@contesting.com
Message: 5
I've updated the Ten-Tec User Links webpage featuring stations with pictures
of their Ten-Tec stations.
http://www.hal-pc.org/~kg5u/tentec.html
73,
dale, kg5u
------------------------------
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 09:52:24 -0400
From: "Ten-Tec Inc. Amateur Radio Sales" <sales@tentec.com>
To: tentec@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Orion heartache
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20030410093503.00a6f5b0@tentec.com>
In-Reply-To: <F8LOyDc41W2ufyWOxbC000189f7@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Reply-To: tentec@contesting.com
Message: 6
At 04:59 PM 4/9/03 -0400, you wrote:
> Although I stand behind my Orion statements, I never posted them, nor
> were they intended for public disclosure.
>
> There have been eleven Orion firmware updates since v1.328 of March
> 28th. There are literally hundreds of software bugs in the control
program.
> 73, Alan K2WS
Good morning:
I am sorry, but that statement is patently false. There are not 'hundreds
of bugs'
in anything that we build. I read the long post here on the reflector,
and it's
obvious that you didn't agree with our user-interface design philosophy for
the Orion.
There is not a whole lot that can be done to overcome that - and that's why
we have a 30 day trial period and don't require an advance deposit for
anything that Ten-Tec builds.
We could just as easily make *fewer* revisions to the Orion firmware and
not release the revision history - that doesn't strike me as being in sync
with
our philosophy of 'telling it like it is' (for lack of a better term).
There have been some comments about "Gee - you better not say anything
bad on the reflector about Ten-Tec's products, or else...." - I think any
long-time reader of this forum will have seen everything from blind praise
to outright hostility over the entire spectrum of what we do. The beauty
of contesting.com is that it's archived for handy reference later.
73
Scott Robbins, W4PA
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Ten-Tec, Inc., 1185 Dolly Parton Pkwy, Sevierville, TN 37862 USA
Contact Mon-Fri Eastern: Office/Tech (865) 453-7172 9 am-5 pm.
Repair (865) 428-0364 8-4. Sales (800) 833-7373 9 am-5:30 pm.
Fax (865) 428-4483 24 hrs. Visit us at <http://www.tentec.com>
Email: New product sales/product info sales@tentec.com
Service department service@tentec.com
While we make every effort to answer email in an expedient manner,
the telephone is a much more efficient tool for getting a quicker and
more complete answer to your inquiries. Thanks!
------------------------------
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End of TenTec Digest, Vol 4, Issue 22
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