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Re: [TenTec] THANK YOU AND APOLOGY

To: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment <tentec@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [TenTec] THANK YOU AND APOLOGY
From: K8JHR <jrichards@k8jhr.com>
Reply-to: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2014 03:54:16 -0400
List-post: <tentec@contesting.com">mailto:tentec@contesting.com>


On 7/26/2014 5:01 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:

The charts on his website are totally misleadding.  That's his take.

--------------------------------------------------


Gentlemen -

I may be mistaken, and greatly misunderstand all this, but to accuse me of deception or misrepresentation is a low blow.

We are supposed to compare radios using these graphs, and I copied them exactly from the respective product reviews. You don't say how or why they are misleading.

I was encouraged by ARRL Lab expert Bob Allison, who reviewed the same graphs and said,

        "THEY HAVE NEARLY THE SAME COMPOSITE NOISE."

(caps added for emphasis.)
__________________


I AM SORRY AND I APOLOGIZE FOR CONSUMING EXCESS BANDWIDTH.

I offered the data in good faith, because thought I understood the issue and could not find the data Rick referred to. Someone said Sherwood had data, but he said no. Someone said ARRL product reviews had the data, so I looked there. I asked ARRL's Lab Technician Bob Allison and he agreed with my assessment, and saying they both have the same noise profile. That seemed reasonable grounds to hold my ground. Perhaps not. Maybe he misunderstood and was talking bout some other type of transmitter noise.


I OFFER A SPECIAL THANK YOU TO ANOTHER LIST MEMBER

who went out of his way to explain how the graphs I found may not depict the same type of noise you guys are talking about. He patiently explained, in a way I can understand, how we reached impasse, and may not be talking about the same thing, and how the data I presented may not be on point, although I offered it in good faith because I thought it was correct.

Terms such as "Phase Noise" and "broad band noise" and "transmitter noise" are bandied about as if they are the same thing. The ARRL product reviews graphically represent "transmitter noise" without explaining exactly what type of noise they are talking about. Is that "phase noise" or "broadband noise" or some other "transmitter noise" - obviously, I am having a hard time sorting it all out.

I appreciate the extra guidance I received from that special List Member, who explained how each side of the debate is pointing in different ways at different things, yet unable to move the other side to its position. That helped a lot.

I apologize for my misunderstanding - but sometimes it is hard to accept what one person says when it conflicts with what others you trust might say. Heck, I figure even engineers can be mistaken, at least sometimes, and it is hard to know which engineer to believe when other engineers disagree.

I learned a hard lesson from this, namely a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, and a rookie cannot always play in the big league. Still, it was unfair to accuse of deception or misrepresentation.

In any event, I apologize for fighting hard for what I thought was correct, and I yield the floor to the experts.

------------------ James - K8JHR ----------------

Just for the record, this is Mr. Allison's complete post to show I am not taking matters out of context and demonstrate I acted on his advice in good faith. I thought he said I was correct.

________________________________________
From: Allison, Bob, WB1GCM
Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2014 7:52 PM
To: Allison, Bob, WB1GCM
Subject: RE: Transmitter Noise  Issue  Puleeeze help !

Looking at the composite noise on our web site (Product Reviews by Manufacturer), the Eagle is a little bit better in the composite noise area than the TS-590S, but both are considered reasonable. The only time when this issue would come up would be Field Day, when two transceivers are trying to use the same ham band; one on phone, one on CW. In such a case, the stations would likely be at least 100 kHz apart from each other. Thus, at 100 kHz from the carrier, both have nearly the same composite noise. This not an issue.

Bob
________________________________________


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