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Re[2]: [TowerTalk] Re: [Force 12 Talk] Rivets

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Subject: Re[2]: [TowerTalk] Re: [Force 12 Talk] Rivets
From: (WD4K)
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 10:15:57 -0600
HI Bob, I don't say much on here but what you wrote is VERY WELL SAID. I
have been following the F12 discussion with interest while just shaking my
head in amazement at the drugstore consumer advocates. Their hair is up and
most probably don't even own a F12 product:) I have two C31's that have been
assembled, up, down, unassembled, assembled and up again over the last
couple of years. Not one single problem and ALWAYS a good experience with
F12, Tom and Natan. Most of my local ham friends also have some F12 product
and their experiences are the same as mine. I personally feel that it is
fair and warranted to use the lists ONLY when ALL efforts to deal with a
company directly have failed. All efforts in vain is the only circumstance
when we as amateur consumers should close ranks to help our own with
manufacturer problems. My 2 cents. Tommy WD4K

-----Original Message-----
[]On Behalf Of Bob Otto
Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2001 7:54 AM
Subject: Re[2]: [TowerTalk] Re: [Force 12 Talk] Rivets

Hello Dale,

I agree.  In fact I'd go a step farther.  I think it's correct that
they DO NOT answer those kinds of posts here.  If they did we'd have
to rename the list to "TowerDabate&Bash"

This list is for technical discussion about Towers, antennas, etc.  I
think it is very pertinent to post a problem with a piece of equipment
and ask if others have seen the same problem and how they handled it.
I can even see suggestions for improvements, etc., for a given product

The problem is that some people use the list as an "equalizer" to
relieve their frustrations and vent their anger.  I belong to many HAM
lists and it's the same on all.  Joe Blow has a problem with a product
and he/she turns it into a "David and Goliath" by bashing the company
and making it a public debate on a list, hoping to scare the company
into doing something because of the bad publicity.

Anyone here can say anything they please.  There's no way for other
readers to know if the person really assembled the product correctly,
substituted parts, used the product in a way that it wasn't designed
for, etc.  The post here was an interesting example.  Two or three
people said they had problems with rivets in high winds.  In this
case, it quickly became "bash Force12" because they don't acknowledge
the problem.  People quickly forgot that Force12 has probably sold
1000's of antennas and has one of the BEST reputations in the entire
industry.  No one says, lets really analyze this problem -- lets' look
at the assembly process. How were the rivets installed. What tools
were used. Were the rivets formed properly. Did the person open holes
to make it easier. Etc., etc., etc.   Some people don't want to "fix
the problem", they just want the company to make them "right",
regardless of what the real "root cause" of the problem was.  Instead,
the charge became "lets make Force12 behave *responsibly*".

It seems to me *WE* have a responsibility to report FACTS and attack a
problem look for a design or process improvements, not to
use our list to whine and bash companies or products.

73 from.......

Bob Otto
Cincinnati, Ohio

Time Written:
8:18:31 AM

DXCC 10M         ** DX is !! **        WAS 10M
       There is a very fine line between
         "HOBBY" and "MENTAL ILLNESS"
When trouble arises and things look really bad,
there is always one individual who perceives a
solution and is willing to take command.
Thursday, March 01, 2001, 2:13:35 AM, you wrote:

>> What does surprise me is that the factory has not felt it
>> necessary to respond
>> to all of the correspondence on this subject.  Are they trying to hide
>> something?

DLM> Huh???

DLM> It seems to me that if someone has spent a few/many hundred dollars on
DLM> antennas and is concerned and/or worried about something that they
DLM> the company may or may not be 'hiding,' they should not be
ratchet-jawing on
DLM> e-mail, they should be on the phone or do it in a formal letter.

DLM> geesh!

DLM> dale, kg5u

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