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[Towertalk] RE: Hit water digging hole - advice?

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Subject: [Towertalk] RE: Hit water digging hole - advice?
From: (
Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:54:34 -0700
Don't forget the size of the project:
The size of the footing; 
The distance of the free fall; can't free fall concrete too far any way 
(again it separates) 
The mass of the water; is there enough water mass to wash the aggregate
(a tower footing for an amateur antenna, NOT LIKELY)
This is the problem with going to extremes and message board with
engineers that have never done the work they can't read between the
lines of on paper and the real world. EVERY THING MIKE WROTE WAS
ABSOLUTELY CORRECT but over kill for this small project.    


-----Original Message-----
[] On Behalf Of Mike Newman
Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 3:24 PM
Subject: [Towertalk] RE: Hit water digging hole - advice?

Never freefall concrete into standing water, and never place any
concrete into flowing water.

The problem with pouring free-falling concrete into water is that the
paste in the mix is washed out of the wet concrete as it hits the water.
The result is that the aggregate is cleaned of the cement paste, leaving
heap of aggregate resting on the bottom of the excavation at the point
the concrete is deposited.  This heap of aggregate lacks strength from
cement bonding, and since it contains voids, provides no protection to
reinforcement laid in the excavation.

If you can get a trough or flume into the base of the excavation
standing water then you could flow the concrete down the trough to the
of the excavation, provided the depth of water is shallow - inches not

It is often useful to dig the excavation with a fall to a small sump in
corner of the excavation away from the start of the pour, and keep a
working in the excavation removing water displaced by concrete poured on
opposite side of the excavation.

Proven methods of concreting underwater are to use a tremie bucket or to
pump through a pipeline and hose, keeping the end of the bucket or hose
submersed at all times (that way the concrete is prevented from
into water), or to fill the excavation with an aggregate (without the
and then to inject cement grout (may need to contain bentonite) into the
aggregate from the bottom.  The grout will displace the water upwards,
the water can be removed from the top surface when the grout appears at
top of the aggregate,  This is called pre-packed concrete.  Be sure to
remove the depth of laitance and weak concrete from the surface.

Some of the advice given in the past few days has directly contradicted

The difficulty with just pouring the concrete without taking precautions
using proper techniques is that the no one gets to see the defects since
evidence is buried .  The defects can only be revealed by taking
cores -an expensive process, and one which I have called on on several
occasions when the techniques used have been questionable.   It's a
call when you see the voids in a core sample where the concrete is
or only loose aggregate exists.  Often there is no practicable remedy
than grout injection, an expensive process.

The rule is - get it right, first time.

Mike  ZL1BNB

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