We had this discussion on Sweeps last November, so I will recall my
suggested tweak on Sweeps. And I'll reiterate that I believe the
malaise is really confined to CW Sweeps.
And for what its worth, I think the malaise is a result of our own
success. We have a finite pool of CW ops in Sweeps CW and because we
have become so adept at SO2R, that we drain that pool several hours
faster than we would have in the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s.
That being said...............
-----------------------------------------------
#1 Stations can work other stations twice - once in the first 15 hoursof
the contest and once in the final 30 hours of the contest
or
#2 Stations can work other stations twice - once on 160-40 and once on 20-10
or
#3 Stations an work other stations twice - as long as the second QSO
ison a band other than the first QSO.
73 Rich NN3W
On 3/21/2018 9:51 AM, Gerry Hull wrote:
Guys,
In the end, it's about having fun, is it not? This is a hobby.
What skills are we testing in a competition?
CW copying ability is simply one aspect. In contests like CQWW CW, I would
argue that CW copying ability, among the serious competitors, is not one
of the major factors because all signals are 599 and the Zone is entered
automatically by the logging software. If you are a serious competitor,
you've been copying
CW for a long time. Call signs are not an issue.
In a contest like NAQP, or any contest where there is a "friend" file, you
are trying to get a best rate and multipliers. Getting an odd name from
somebody surprises you,
and may mess up your fun. So -- everyone tends to use their common name.
Using an uncommon name may satisfy your need to "test" other operators,
but it won't help your score. If you are having fun, so be it. If you
have an uncommon name and are itching to win, you have to bear that
burden. Be ACTIVE. We often honor people when they become an SK by
sending their name. This may or may not impact the score. However, it is
a social part of our contesting community. Sometimes the score is not the
most important factor.
If we had a contest (and I believe there are already some) where we
exchanged 5 letter groups of random characters, the CW copying ability
would REALLY be tested.
Would such a contest be popular?
I agree that the KCDX CW copying event is a rush! Lots of fun, pure CW
copying ability. Looking forward to it this year.
73,
Gerry W1VE, VE1RM, VY1AAA
On Tue, Mar 20, 2018 at 9:02 PM, Yuri VE3XB <ve3xb@rogers.com> wrote:
Bob,
Thanks for the response and sharing your opinion. Very interesting concept
indeed.
For the sake of argument I will agree that I was wrong and you, having so
many QSOs during your contesting career, are entitled to start judging the
skills and abilities of the other people. And this is not arrogance, not at
all.
Also, I'm on your side regarding actual copying of the exchange during a
contest and not just hitting the "Enter" key.
But let's go back to the original post where all that started. During NAQP
in order to make a valid contact we need to copy call-sign, name and QTH,
right? So let's assume that I copied from you: KQ2M, EEMIO and CT. Before
logging this QSO, I check what is typed in and I can see your call, your
state BUT, being CANADIAN who came from EASTERN EUROPE, I don't recognize
any name. So what do I do - I ask for the repeat and therefore failing your
"test". Failing not because I miscopied the information you've sent, but
because I've never been to Haiti! Kool, isn't it?
Due to aging HAM radio population we getting more and more experienced
operators who tend to become "On The Air" policemen and judges checking on
others. Some, for example, can put kilowatt carrier on DX frequency and
they
don't mean harm to us, just "testing" our ability to copy weak signals from
under the jamming interference. The others crank output power down to
milliwatts to check your receiving abilities. All of them don't care about
scores - they just having good time.
Back to the Subject.
Bob, to test our and your own copying skills why don't you come to Crown
Plaza on May 19th after the Contest Dinner for annual Kansas City DX Club
Pile-Up competition? There is going to be crowd of great people who came
from all over the world, many friends, lots of fun, camaraderie and booze.
Everyone is equal - doesn't matter how much $$$ invested in aluminum,
equipment and location, whether you are from right or wrong coast - 5
minutes of adrenalin rush and your results are there. You used to attend
this contest but for some reason stopped coming in 1999. After ten years it
could be one of your greatest comebacks. Hope to see you there.
Cheers and 73,
Yuri VE3XB
From: Bob Shohet, KQ2M [mailto:kq2m@kq2m.com]
Yuri, it amazes me that some people make comments before thinking about
what
they actually write and those same people often make assumptions about what
they are writing before having any information.
By definition, contests are about testing your skills and the skills of
others. What makes a contest valid is the test of actually COPYING
information correctly not just relying on the computer to fill it in for
you
when you press "enter".
And because I send with my keyer and not my keyboard, whatever I send, I
have to send myself correctly at whatever speed I am sending it. You can
be
sure that tests my skill plenty - and after 900,000+ CONTEST qso's, about
600,000 of which were made on cw, the last time that I checked, I was still
doing pretty well in the skill category. So NO, it is not like "QRP
ops..... "yada, yada, yada". I am actually sending exchanges, NOT my
computer and .
you might do well to ask next time before you assume. There are few people
alive who have made as many CW qso's as I have and probably no one has ever
made as many cw qso's as me by sending with their keyer rather than their
keyboard/computer.
I am sure that the Haitian man named Eemio that I knew would take issue
with
your characterization of "this kind of joke". There are MANY names which
are unfamiliar to most Americans/Canadians/Eastern Europeans, etc., I
certainly don't think that choosing to use an actual name is a joke -
either
to send or receive. Waste of "valuable" time? Hardly! If you know what
the exchange is before it is even sent then what is actually being tested?
Certainly not COPYING skill; the only thing being "tested" is having enough
coordination to use the keyboard/computer to log for you.
I would never begrudge anyone sending me an unusual name or a name that I
didn't expect, any more than I would begrudge an operator from using qrp or
qrpp. Actually, many lower power guys call me because they know that I
will
listen for them and take the time and make the effort to dig them out -
many
stations won't do that. I certainly don't complain about it or make the
statement that you did:
"if you weren't expecting this kind of joke during contest rush. It just
waste of valuable time, nothing more".
You might want to reconsider that - it sounds pretty arrogant.
I thinks it's nice that low power guys or people with unusual callsigns
would call me even though the burden falls on me (and others) to get their
callsign and information correctly through the contest levels of qrm, qrn,
and qsb. I appreciate that they are in the contest and raising the level
of
activity for all participants. And copying 599TT1 or 59950MW is a lot more
interesting than 599KW. Same with working TG0FRACAP or any of hundreds of
unusual and never before heard callsigns that we are not expecting.
I get that some people don't like to be "challenged" by something unusual.
Yeah, it isn't easy and slows down the rate. And some people don't have a
sense of humor about some things, and aren't very tolerant or forgiving.
But really, this is only a contest. It isn't about truly important stuff
like a person's health or safety or family. Life's too short to argue
about contest exchanges.
73
Bob KQ2M
From: <mailto:ve3xb@rogers.com> Yuri VE3XB
Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2018 11:07 PM
To: <mailto:cq-contest@contesting.com> cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Here's an idea...
Always amazes me.
Some smart guy comes up with "brilliant" idea and he starts testing
everyone
else skills but not his own... It's like QRP ops keep complaining about
big
gun stations that couldn't copy their tiny signals but never call weak
stations themselves.
As a member of QRQ club I can copy CW at 40 wpm and higher speeds but I
would definitely make sure that I copied EEMIO right and will ask for the
repeat. Nothing wrong with that, especially if you weren't expecting this
kind of joke during contest rush. It just waste of valuable time, nothing
more. On the other hand if I had nothing better to do I would come back
with
some fancy name (like Enine, my old friend's name, for example) and see how
well the joker will copy it. Not sure he will.
I guess that most people care about how to get contest exchange copying
easier for their party, but looks like some think otherwise, having fun at
someone else expense...
73 Yuri VE3XB
-----Original Message-----
From: CQ-Contest [ <mailto:cq-contest-bounces@contesting.com>
mailto:cq-contest-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Bob Shohet, KQ2M
A lot time ago in the CW Sprint, I used EEMIO (sent at 40+ wpm of course
:-) and Scandalla amongst other names. EEMIO was pretty funny - almost
impossible to copy correctly at that speed - it was a true test of operator
skill and honesty. Skill to get it right the first time and honesty to ask
again for it when they weren't sure that they got it right. As you would
expect, the best ops got it right on the first or second try, most of the
rest either needing MANY repeats (clearly expecting Bob) or just faking it
and sending "r'" or "tu". I used other unusual names as well to "test" the
ops. I was more interested in having fun with that than achieving a good
score.
Once in the mid-80's, on the way back home after a YCCC meeting in Mass., I
operated for an hour at Hal, W1NN's station in CT, and worked K8CC on two
bands with two different names. When I got back to eastern Long Island in
NY (where I was living at the time), I then worked K8CC again on a 3rd band
using a different name from another state. So I worked Dave a total of
three times - from two different states on three bands and with three
different names (one name per band).
Dave being the FB op that he is, correctly copied each name change and
state
change. I'm pretty sure that Dave still remembers that contest. :-)
73
Bob KQ2M
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