Thanks Jim for the info on the Behringer possible Issues.
BUT.. I am looking for ideas of a Mic. pre-amp.
Now some here may have seen the BAD Can-O-Worms that happened on a
certain contest club E-Mail list. I do NOT want that to happen here.
Please....
But the reply you made below about being not needed is not 100% true.
This is where all the fighting and arguing started.
This has to do with specific items. Mainly these three.
1- A Heil HC-4 Mic. NOT a HC-5 or any other Mic but a HC-4 and ONLY
talking about a HC-4.
2- An Icom IC-7300. NOT a 7000, or a 9100 ONLY talking about an IC-7300.
3- A typical DELL Windows 10 Desktop computer, with a soundblaster
soundcard.
The story goes, I bought one of the last headsets that Heil made that
still had the HC-4 element in it. I love the sound, it is very similar
to the old school Astatic D-104 or the Shure 444. Awesome!
And on my Old Kenwood TS-430S It works great with just the simple 1mf
phantom power blocking cap that Heil recommends. But that old Kenwood
was designed to work with low level output mic's.
When we wanted to do a Multi op effort in Phone SS we wanted to for sure
use that headset and mic.
But when we tried to use it on the stations IC-7300 the modulation was
extremely Low. Doing research we learned like on many web sites, and on
the Facebook 7300 owners page this is extremely common.
It is sooo common, that even Bob Heil right on his website even
specifically covers the subject and says.
Max the Mic Gain, and use the compressor as a secondary mic gain to get
enough drive! HEIL EVEN SAYS THIS!
right from their site......
All Things iCOM
Microphone Basics
DSP and Mic Gain Settings
When using a dynamic element on rigs like iCOMs, which were designed for
electret microphone elements, one must not be afraid to do two things:
_*(1) utilize the full range of Mic Gain available*_, and *_(2) turn on
the Compression, using the Compression Level control as a secondary Mic
Gain control if necessary._*
I was told and I abbreviate here, this statement is pure "BS" Even tho
it is copied from Heils own site.
I tried to explain That maybe for those that it works for are yellers.
Guys that always talk very loudly into their mic's. I see it when doing
multi op's all the time. And they don't even know or think they are
talking loudly. Like this guy, he doesn't seem loud yet he is talking so
loud you can hear his voice bouncing off the walls. And as his
excitement grows he gets even louder!
https://youtu.be/THXCA-6S_Fc
There under 99% circumstances in my 45 years of being a Ham, I have
never had to talk that loud EVER!
We always talk at a level that is clear and pronounce as well as
possible yet at a volume level that as long as we are wearing headphones
our speech is low enough that the others in the multi op effort can
actually sleep in the same room!
There never should be a need to have to speak this loudly as in that
video. NEVER should it be needed.
Plus, when we wanted to record wav files for CQ's etc. the HC-4 with the
blocking cap of course, even with every gain maxed out on the computer,
there was not enough audio.
So the station owner hooked up that Behringer,
now the Behringer XENYX 802 has a switchable Phantom power option, which
is good because you can't apply any power to a dynamic mic. It may or
may not hurt the mic. At best it makes it not work at all. At worst
could smoke the thing. And the Behringer XENYX 802 unit if it put power
into the dynamic mic, to the Behringer XENYX 802 unit the HC-4 looks
like a dead short, and it could even smoke The Behringer itself.
SO to play it safe Steve put between the Mic, and the Behringer XENYX
802, an Isolation transformer. Heil says to just use a 1Mf cap. anyway
this seemed better anyway it provided the isolation from any Phantom
power if it should by accident get turned on.
PLUS this unit looks like it is also an Impedance Transformer unit also.
First impedances
The Mic. states it is a 600 Ohm unit.
The Behringer XENYX 802 says it likes a Minimum of 15K ohms and Optimal
is around 100K ohms.
Quite a bit of mismatch. Now this isolator/transformer I can not find a
LOT of data on. like ratios of transforming or how it even works because
the labeling is somewhat confusing.
Make & Model, Radio Shack, 2740017
I know this group won't pass images, but I have the schematic for it,
and it shows it and how it can be made to transform high or low. but
it's somewhat confusing.
Anyway the Behringer and this isolator/transformer worked and worked
great. We saved a lot of voices from not having to talk LOUDLY. I mean
the guy operating could be soo quiet that people still in the room gould
be like 6 feet away, and not understand what he is saying because it is
too faint.
It is just that it the Behringer is way overkill and large.
A recent QST article describes this exact problem and how to make a
simple pre-amp to fix this.
A mic preamp for using a dynamic mic with radios designed for electrets
in the Hints and Kinks column of the Dec 18 QST I think it was 2018 year?
He made it very simple, but when we tried we had RF issues getting into
it that we just could not fix.
Just looking for ideas of alternatives, and even withwhat is happening
with the Behringer and that transformer thing. being 600 ohm mic and
way high impedance on the amp.
Joe WB9SBD
On 8/1/2020 2:03 AM, Jim Brown wrote:
On 7/31/2020 8:51 AM, Joe wrote:
Has anyone here used a Behringer XENYX 802 as a pre amp for a low
level output Dynamic type of Mic?
A preamp is un-necessary for dynamic mics in nearly all modern ham
rigs (i.e., within the last 50 years). All that is needed is to wire
it correctly.
In the pro audio world, Behringer long ago earned a reputation for low
build quality, lousy support, and poor business practices. There are
plenty of good alternatives.
73, Jim K9YC
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