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Re: [RFI] shielding question

To: rfi@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [RFI] shielding question
From: <dgsvetan@rockwellcollins.com>
Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:30:23 -0600
List-post: <mailto:rfi@contesting.com>

Ladies and Gentlemen of this list:

I have to toss in a few words alongside Jim's.  I am member of the IEEE and
the IEEE Standards Activity, IEEE-SA.  I am also chair of a standards
working group within IEEE.  As Jim said in another posting, like AES, IEEE
standards and conference publications are written by volunteers who are
unpaid by the sponsor.  The sponsoring organization, be it AES or IEEE,
copyrights the material, with one notable exception:  in the case of IEEE
(and probably other similar organizations), papers written by US Government
employees are NOT subject to IEEE copyright.  The same is true for US
Government documents, such as MIL-STDs.  They are not copyrighted.  Thus,
those documents can be freely (in every sense of the word) distributed.
Otherwise, the copyright owners (IEEE, AES, etc.) have every right to
charge for their publications, and the charge is not to pad the coffers of
these types of organizations for the purpose of great profit.  The purpose
is to enable the continuation of these sort of organizations to provide the
technical platforms needed for development and dissemination of standards
and related technical information that are the underlying basis for most of
what we do in our various fields of endeavor.

The primary customers for these documents and publications are other
professionals, both within private industry and in government.  Yes, the US
Government pays for the copies of these documents it needs to conduct
various portions of its business.  Heck, one of the standards for which I
chaired the working group, IEEE-299-1997, "Method for Measuring the
Shielding Effectiveness of Electromagnetic Shielding Enclosures", replaced
MIL-STD-285 (Uncle Sam cancelled it). Now, Uncle uses the IEEE document.
It is not practical to verify each prospective user's purpose for a
document.  The organizations can not reasonably differentiate between a
professional who can easily pay (with his employer's credit card) $10,
$100, or more, for a document, or a ham radio operator who would have to
scrape his jeans pockets (and a few other places) for the cash.  While I do
agree that some articles and documents are very heavily laden with complex
math, the electronic concepts (which is where the real value of most of
these documents lie) should be understandable by anyone with a ham license
above Novice class.  If you come across something you don't understand, go
back to your ham license study guide, get out the ARRL Handbook, or head to
your library.  Shielding is a complex issue and science unto itself, but
the underlying concepts are not difficult to understand.  Its the way in
which those concepts work that can be a real brain teaser, even for the
full time pros.

I can not begin to tell you what chaos there would be in the world without
the continued existence of standards and related organizations.  Think
about what it might be like if there were no standard for the color of
traffic signal lights or automotive turn signal indicator lights.
Incidentally, there are standards for EMC within vehicles, but they are not
necessarily compulsory.  That's one reason we hams do well with mobile
installations in some vehicles, and burn out the engine processor in

Happy Holidays,

Dale, WA9ENA

                      "Jim Brown"                                               
                      <jimbrown.enterac        To:       "RFI List" 
                      t@rcn.com>               cc:                              
                      Sent by:                 Subject:  Re: [RFI] shielding 
                      12/23/2003 03:17                                          
                      Please respond to                                         
                      Jim Brown                                                 

No, I'm sorry that I can't do that. When you publish with AES, they
have distribution rights. I don't get any of the money.

I can promise you that the papers are worth your time and money if you
are interested in the science of this. I spent the better part of a
year on the four of them, and they were very well received at both
conventions where they were presented. Some members of the AES
Standards committee called the Amsterdam papers the hit of that 4-day
convention, and some Canadian EE profs (one a past president of the AES
who chaired the NY session) where the NY papers were papers were
presented were also quite excited about them. The test setups are fully
documented, and there is a lot of data on cable types, products, and
wiring methods that cause and solve problems. These papers are all
about the science of RFI.


On Tue, 23 Dec 2003 00:52:25 -0800, Jim Smith wrote:

>Hi Jim,
>I found the site where the papers are but AES wants $10 each for them.
> Is it possible that you, being the author, can put them up on a web
>site and let the folks on this reflector know where to find them?

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