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Re: Topband: TX relays

To: "Stan Stockton" <wa5rtg@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Topband: TX relays
From: "Tom W8JI" <w8ji@w8ji.com>
Reply-to: Tom W8JI <w8ji@w8ji.com>
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2014 11:48:30 -0400
List-post: <topband@contesting.com">mailto:topband@contesting.com>

What would be a better choice for a stack match?

I'm quite sure that in the heat of a contest these things have been hot switched on rare occasion with 1500w. There was one time when I intentionally hot switched one of them with 100w because I thought the receive signal was down 10dB or so. Problem went away. Anyway I've been using them for about 6 years or so and only had one that failed after a big lightening strike.

Stan, K5GO


Hi Stan,

There is a direct opposition between a contact able to take an intense arc in switching and a contact that is low resistance and maintains low resistance without "wetting" (wetting is a significant steady voltage that burns off the micro-thin sulfide and contaminant layer).

I'm sure there is stuff on line by relay manufacturers. Relay contact issues on receive are probably the number one problem manufacturers face. This might not show in a stack switch because the receiver will often receive through some path, even if the stack connection is not what it is on transmit. The same is true for directional arrays, where an element or two might drop from the system on receive, and the operator be unaware it is even happening.

Receive drop out problems like this might be masked in a stack or directional switch, but they are clearly evident in an antenna selector switch and in an amplifier antenna transfer relay. Since there are not multiple receive paths to some portion of the antenna system, they go completely dead. In a stack or directional array, you just lose pattern. The operator is just not aware of the problem because it is not hitting him in the head with a 2x4.

You really don't want to hot switch anything with RF. It is not only rough on the relay, it is rough on gear.

There are two ways to handle most systems. It is possible to build a small external box that disallows hot switching. It is also possible in some cases to build the relay box in a way that does not permit open contact conditions, which is called a "make before break" system.

Most of the control stuff I'm involved with has hot switch protection. The DXE 4 square controller, for example, disallows switching while the TX control line is low. It switches when the TX line is high, but locks off the amplifier relay control line for a preprogrammed time until the relays have time to settle. It also cycles the relays repeatedly and rapidly on initial power-up to wipe contacts.

The RCS 12 Ameritron does the same for hot switch. The RCS12 not only locks out hot switching, it locks out the wrong band. If an RCS12 is connected to band data from the radio it could provide automatic band antenna selection plus stack selection on one box, and include hot switch lockout.

I load my contest station with RCS12's so operators cannot pick the wrong antenna for the band, and so they cannot hot switch. They can actually change antennas by stabbing a button during transmit, and the RCS12 holds off the transfer until the TX drops. When TX drops it opens the amplifier control line, and then transfers the relay. After the relay transfers it allows amplifier use again. This way someone cannot pick the wrong antenna, and they cannot transfer a relay while the amplifier is on line.

When I design a stack box or any relay system, one of my considerations is to try to not permit wiring or contact conditions that allow open transfer loads on feeders in the relay box itself. This is called make before break operation. Sometimes this complicates the relay system, but it improves life in the field. Often it is not possible, but I generally spend some time trying to find a way to do this on any new projects. It is sometimes possible with a stack box and other switching, but it is impossible with an antenna transfer relay without greatly increasing cost.

The end result of this is usually increased cost, which causes people with dysthymic disorder to publically vent, but in the long term it is better to make a system more difficult to break. It is a bigger PITA for me to have to go out and change a board with 10 or 15 relays because of operator error than it is to just prevent the problem.

73 Tom
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