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[TowerTalk] measuring and using the term impedance

To: <towertalk@contesting.com>
Subject: [TowerTalk] measuring and using the term impedance
From: "Al Williams" <alwilliams@olywa.net>
Date: Sun, 15 May 2005 19:32:44 -0700
List-post: <mailto:towertalk@contesting.com>
I am surprised that no posting has questioned these measurements!  It seems 
to me that specifying impedance without including the phase angle ( or R +- 
jx ) is of little use in understanding what is happening.  Am I missing 
something?

Could it be that the impedance is of little concern when trying to determine 
how to best install radials so that the issue of impedance terminology was 
ignored?

k7puc

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Dinsterdog@aol.com>
To: <towertalk@contesting.com>
Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:07 AM
Subject: [TowerTalk] 4080V test get interesting per W8JI suggestions


>I have no idea why I didn't test things at the antenna but chalk it up to
> new born twins....
>
> Here are the 80M results:
>
> 3.770Mhz                       3.789MHz                      3.826Mhz
>
> 42 ohm impedance         42 ohm  impedance        55 ohm impedance
>
> 2:1  SWR                         1.4  SWR                       2.0 SWR
>
> Bandwidth at 2:1 is only 56 Khz.  Manual states 100Khz at  2:1 Had 30Khz 
> more
> bandwidth in the shack.  Coax feedline was making a  difference here.
>
> Take the radials off and Boom!
>
> 3.870Mhz                       3.883Mhz    3.910Mhz
>
> 80 ohm impedance         80  ohm impedance        85 ohm impedance
>
> 2.0  SWR                        1.6  SWR                       2.0  SWR
>
> 40 Khz of bandwidth.........?  I thought it would go higher with a  less
> efficient antenna.  A 94Khz jump in resonant point.
>
> THE 40M results:
>
> 7.132Mhz                       9.972Mhz                      6.846Mhz
>
> 80 ohm impedance         50 ohm  impedance       48 ohm impedance
>
> 2.0  SWR                       1.2  SWR                        2.0 SWR
>
> 286Khz bandwidth as advertised, or close enough.  Resonant point  slightly
> lower by 10Khz than measured in shack.
>
>
> 40M Results with No Radials-
>
> 7.213Mhz                     7.286MHz                          7.392Mhz
>
> impedance 60 ohms      impedance 70  ohms          impedance 90  ohms
>
> 2.0  SWR                       1.6  SWR                           2.0 SWR
>
> Conclusion:  I still have a 8-10 ohm difference in impedance when 
> comparing
> 40 meters to 80 meters at the feed point with or without radials 
> attached.
> So it is the antenna.   I had a suggestion  emailed to me that it is 
> because
> the 80M antenna portion is a 1/4 design and the  40M antenna is a 1/2 wave
> design.  This would explain the size of the 40M  coil considering the 
> antenna
> itself is almost a quarter wave in length for 40  meters.
>
> Also, it goes to show the huge difference even a small radial field can
> make.  I use very heavy insulated hard copper wire but if you saw my  puny 
> back
> yard, you would wonder why I am even trying a low band array.
>
> Any input on these numbers is appreciated except by SWR critics.  This 
> all
> about impedance and the effect it can have in an array.  If this was  just 
> a
> stand alone antenna, I would not be putting the effort in.  Also, I  don't 
> plan
> to operate below 7.000Mhz.  I was using an analyzer.  I  just can't wait 
> for
> those questions.
>
> Thank you=  And thank you to those with some excellent  suggestions-
>
> 73
>
> Paul  N0AH
> _______________________________________________
>
> See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless 
> Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with 
> any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TowerTalk mailing list
> TowerTalk@contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
> 

_______________________________________________

See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless Weather 
Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with any questions 
and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.

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