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Re: [CQ-Contest] ARRL to allow self-spotting in contests

To: Paul O'Kane <pokane@ei5di.com>, "'CQ-Contest@contesting. com'" <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] ARRL to allow self-spotting in contests
From: David Gilbert <ab7echo@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2022 20:18:43 -0700
List-post: <mailto:cq-contest@contesting.com>
Unless you're using a rig made 30 years ago, any CW signal you receive 
has already been sliced, diced, unsliced and undiced a LOT more than you 
apparently realize.  Nobody, including you, "hears" RF ... it is all 
extensively converted and manipulated (RF filtering, digital mixing, 
audio filtering, etc) before it gets to your ears. It has even been 
quite heavily massaged on transmit ... filtering, compression, and wave 
shaping.
I'm simply suggesting the addition of some more effective signal 
processing using modern techniques ... techniques, by the way, that 
COULD be included in the firmware of any rig and you would never know 
the difference as long as you were talking to somebody that had a rig 
with similar features.  Except, of course, that you'd be able to 
communicate with better S/N performance than folks who didn't have that 
capability.
73,
Dave   AB7E


On 2/19/2022 3:04 PM, Paul O'Kane wrote:
This argument is futile.  Regardless of how FT8 works, CW is an analog 
mode along its entire RF signal path - a mode that can be decoded by 
people.   If CW is sliced and diced to make it a digital RF mode that 
has to be un-sliced and un-diced before being output in an audible 
form, then it's no longer CW.
AB7E is welcome to his "enhanced CW", but count me out - it's time to 
get real.
73,
Paul EI5DI


On 19/02/2022 20:55, David Gilbert wrote:
I know how FT8 works (I've studied Joe's papers and researched the 
principles) and I would have no intention of making anything else 
work like FT8 does.  It's simply too restrictive, particularly for 
contesting.  But the signal processing behind FT8 is applicable to 
several different communication formats. If you really knew how FT8 
works you'd understand that.
Dave  AB7E


On 2/18/2022 2:30 PM, Peter Voelpel wrote:
You better read how FT-8 works and compare

-----Original Message-----
From: David Gilbert [mailto:ab7echo@gmail.com]
Sent: Freitag, 18. Februar 2022 22:13
To: Peter Voelpel; cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] ARRL to allow self-spotting in contests


Wrong.  FT8 has nothing to do with CW, but the signal processing behind
it could be used to significantly enhance CW.  Think RTTY with MUCH
better S/N and an audible output instead of text on the screen.

73,
Dave   AB7E


On 2/18/2022 12:03 PM, Peter Voelpel wrote:
That communication technique has nothing in common with CW at all!

73
Peter, DJ7WW

-----Original Message-----
From: CQ-Contest
[mailto:cq-contest-bounces+dj7ww=t-online.de@contesting.com] On Behalf Of
David Gilbert

The signal processing techniques utilized in FT8 could have been used to
enhance the signal-to-noise of normal CW in a way that would have been
virtually transparent to the operator

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