Hi Pat,
A quite interesting and informative post, thanks.
I would be interested in hearing about folks experiences with
verticals and radials "in" the salt water.
In ON4UNs excellent book, he mentions that it is best to use copper
plates and to have them submerged so as much "skin" of the waterline
is touching the copper plate as possible (perhaps using floats?)
Fully submerged radials would be akin to having wire radials
underneath a copper plate.
Anyway, you've peaked my interest Pat, and i was wondering if any
folks have gone the whole hog and would like to talk about their
experience(s) with radials in the water.
Cheers,
Chris.
On 7/28/07, Pat Barthelow <aa6eg@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >From the Team Vertical experience, on Jamaica, things get REALLY
> interesting if your verticals are literally on the wet, sandy beach, if you
> have that luxury.
>
> Another anecdote: Type in: Monterey Bay Aquarium in Google Maps, and get
> a map of what the locals call "New Monterey" above (famous, John
> Steinbeck's) Cannery Row. Go look south a little bit, look for the corner
> of Spencer and Hoffman. (Hoffman is perpendicular to Cannery Row) That is
> near where a friend, W6UQZ's modest QTH with an inverted L, and various
> other apartment back yard wire antenna live. John, a skilled operator on
> CW, while mobile, uses a ham stick mobile installation to chase DX.
> Numerous times, I have stopped by his house while he spots DX, either via
> the internet, or live over the air on his backyard antennas, tries calling
> them, and if unsuccessful, hops into his car, and drives the mile or so to
> the Monterey Wharf to try some more to catch the DX.
>
> John called my attention to listen to the DX in the mobile while he drove
> the mile or so to the wharf. All I can say is , WOW! From barely
> readable in the driveway, the DX signals invariably made a steady increase
> in strength as we got closer and closer to the ocean. To the point when
> John was parked out on the wharf, with a clear view of the water by the
> antenna, and perhaps 15 ft above the water surface,
>
> http://adamschneider.net/photos/2000-09-sc/image/pb250386.jpg
>
> a lot of DX signals were PROFOUNDLY loud.
> The band positively crackled, quite diffrent from a duller atmosphere at his
> home qth.
>
> I was not looking at the meters, (and they aren't accurate in an objective
> way, anyway, but the signals climbed from a weak driveway reference level to
> a PROFOUNDLY louder, powerful signal level, almost every time. Once parked
> on the wharf, John's 100 watts to the hamstick while on the wharf,
> invariably got the DX station in a very short time.
>
> If you are ever in Monterey, with an HF mobile, try this, it is a real eye
> opener, even to those who already know/believe that Salt water/salty
> sand/soil helps..
>
> Sincerely, Pat Barthelow aa6eg@hotmail.com
> http://www.jamesburgdish.org
> Jamesburg Earth Station Moon Bounce Team
>
> http://www.cq-vhf.com
> >From: <john@kk9a.com>
> >To: <TOWERTALK@contesting.com>
> >CC: jknodel@msn.com
> >Subject: [TowerTalk] How close does a vertical have to be to saltwater
> >toseeany benefit
> >Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2007 21:06:49 -0400
> >
> >You are way too far away from the salt water to have enhanced radiation
> >below the Pseudo Brewster angle.
> >
> >John KK9A
> >
> >
> >
> >To: Tower Forum <towertalk@contesting.com>
> >Subject: [TowerTalk] How close does a vertical have to be to saltwater
> >tosee
> >any benefit?
> >From: Jon M Knodel
> >Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2007 15:11:54 -0700
> >List-post: <mailto:towertalk@contesting.com>
>
> Here is my question - Just how close does a vertical have to be to saltwater
> >to see any benefit over typical ground? We all know that a vertical over
> >saltwater is excellent, but I want to know if it would be much of a benefit
> >to put one up at my location.
> >I am located on a peninsula and my qth is about 1.25 miles from the ocean
> >to
> >the west and about 0.5 miles to a saltwater bay to the east. Our soil is
> >100% sand and typically have a very high ground water table. Would this
> >proximity to saltwater give me any benefit over a station without any
> >saltwater around
> >anywhere with the same vertical antenna? Or would it take the same
> >vertical
> >installed DIRECTLY over saltwater to see any benefit from the saltwater?
> >Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
> >Jon N7XW
>
>
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