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Re: [TowerTalk] vertical antenna ground loss

To: towertalk@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] vertical antenna ground loss
From: Steve Hunt <steve@karinya.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 19:27:46 +0000
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Denny,

I've spent some more time wading through LB's pages, but I'm struggling 
to find anything that suggests he thinks the modelling might not be valid.

The most pertinent page "Horizontal vs.Vertical Antennas on the Low HF 
Bands" is here:
http://www.cebik.com/content/gup/gup8.html

LB's elevation plots for a 40m dipole 1/4 wave above ground are exactly 
the same as mine - nowhere does he suggests the model is invalid.

His verticals outperform the dipole at low elevation angles; but note 
that he chose a half-wave vertical elevated by 10ft and a half-square 
20ft off the ground. Take a look at his Figure 9 and picture what a 
quarter-wave vertical at ground level would look like - very similar to 
the dipole at low angles.

I'm confused as to why you are encouraging me to read Cebik when his 
work seems to confirm the figures I published earlier?

Steve G3TXQ





Steve Hunt wrote:
> Denny,
>
> Do you have a specific Cebik article in mind?
>
> I'm pretty familiar with his work and I just re-read his 5-part article 
> on modelling 160m verticals, but I can't immediately see anything that 
> suggests the modelling is significantly in error.
>
> Regards,
> Steve G3TXQ
>
> Dennis OConnor wrote:
>   
>> Steve, I agree that is what a Mininec model likely shows... 
>> A model is not the real world... 
>> A good read of Cebik in this subject will give additional information...
>> ...
>> And while my example may be a bit overwrought, it mirrors real world 
>> performance...  
>> The whole point of my post is that real world GP vertical performance is not 
>> as dismal as a Mininec plot suggests...
>> And a low, horizontal antenna is not as necessarily as good at low angles as 
>> Mininec suggests...
>>
>> cheers
>> denny / k8do
>>
>>
>>       
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