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[TowerTalk] Fwd: Fwd: Fwd: OWAs or Fans?

To: towertalk@contesting.com
Subject: [TowerTalk] Fwd: Fwd: Fwd: OWAs or Fans?
From: Hans Hammarquist via TowerTalk <towertalk@contesting.com>
Reply-to: Hans Hammarquist <hanslg@aol.com>
Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2016 20:32:32 -0400
List-post: <towertalk@contesting.com">mailto:towertalk@contesting.com>
OK, this is how I am doing it:


1) My antenna tuner is isolated from ground. 2) the coax from the tuner to the 
radio is passing a choke. This render a balanced feed to the antenna feeder. I 
hope that clears that up a little. The technique was presented at a seminar at 
Boxboro some years ago.


So, answeres:


1) I have a 250 feet wire, fed 1/3 from one end in the air. Call it a Windom if 
you like.


2) The feed line is attached directly to the antenna.


3) The choke is (technically) at the ground end of the feed line.


4) The feed line is connected to the ground isolated antenna tuner. The 
isolation contribute to equal, balanced current in the feeder.


5) The choke is on the 50 ohm side of the tuner.


6) Yes, as the tuner is "acting" balanced. The tuner is, in reality unbalanced 
but as it doesn't have a return path to ground the high Z is by all means 
balanced.


7) The transceiver end of the coax has the shield grounded (to the shack 
shield. The shack shield is connected to the tower.)


I don't know if I explained it clearly but the tuner is "floating" from ground 
as the transceiver side is connected to the choke. That way the antenna side is 
balanced.


The tuner is homebuilt. It consist of a tuned circuit that is tapped for proper 
SWR. I have several of them. Each one covers about 3 - 1 in frequency. I am 
using four to cover 160 - 10 meter.


My question and interest is to get a CM choke next to the antenna so I can 
reduce the radiation from the feeder.


Hans - N2JFS




-----Original Message-----
From: Edward McCann <edwmccann@yahoo.com>
To: Hans Hammarquist <hanslg@aol.com>; towertalk <towertalk@contesting.com>
Cc: edward mccann <edwmccann@aol.com>
Sent: Mon, Jun 20, 2016 12:32 am
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Fwd:  Fwd: OWAs or Fans?

Hans:

Your initial inquiry asked about CM choke for open (and ladder line, I presume) 
feeder.

I passed on K9YC's counsel on the topic.

Your latest message has me a bit confused:

"I have a setup with the tuner isolated from ground and a CCM chock made of 50' 
of coax wound around a 4" PVC pipe. The chock is fairly wide band by NOT having 
an even pitch on the winding. The choke insure that there is no CM current 
entering the shack."


So, for clarity:

1. What antenna is in the air?
2. Is it fed with open wire feedline?
3. Where is your CM choke in the line?
4. From antenna, at you CM Choke,  do you connect one side of open wire to coax 
center conductor and other to ground?
5. Coming out of CM Choke, are you back to open wire feedline to tuner?
6. Is this open feedline hooked into balanced terminals of tuner?
7. Antenna side seems isolated from ground at tuner. But what about output side 
of tuner? Now coax, right, and transceiver chassis ( and therefore shield of 
coax) is now grounded. It is this not the case?

PS-what tuner are you using?

Thanks for clarification on this most interesting topic, i.e. A CM Choke for 
open feeder.

73,
Ed McCann
AG6CX




Are you using an open wire feed?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 16, 2016, at 3:04 PM, Hans Hammarquist via TowerTalk 
> <towertalk@contesting.com> wrote:
> 
> I am very fortuned not being surrounded by noise. Next door neighbor is 1000 
> feet away with no TV or any other RFI source and next neighbor is 1/2 mile 
> away. Wonder if I can make a CM choke for an open feeder. Any idea?
> 
> 
> Hans - N2JFS
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jim Brown <jim@audiosystemsgroup.com>
> To: towertalk <towertalk@contesting.com>
> Sent: Thu, Jun 16, 2016 1:19 pm
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Fwd: OWAs or Fans?
> 
>> On Thu,6/16/2016 7:26 AM, Hans Hammarquist via TowerTalk wrote:
>> Open wire feeders are simple to use if you know to address a few things
> 
> 
> The thing that it is NOT POSSIBLE to address is choking the feedline at 
> the feedpoint (that is, where it junctions the dipole). This makes the 
> antenna inherently noisy in most parts of the real world. Off-center-fed 
> antennas like Windoms are even worse in that regard.
> 
> This doesn't mean that they don't radiate -- that's NOT the issue. 
> There's nothing wrong with these antennas in concept, only that we as 
> hams are surrounded by RF noise sources.
> 
> 73, Jim K9YC
> 
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