He sends QRP R5. Now how do you log 1/2 watt?
Waltk at PICA.ARMY.MIL
Waltk at PICA.ARMY.MIL
Fri Feb 24 14:46:01 EST 1995
The best Power Report I got over the weekend was a
dude sending R5. Hmm I sez, say that again, mahn.
He sends QRP R5. Now how do you log a 1/2 watt?
I put down 1, but really now, what is he supposed
to send when he's running flea power?
.......................................................................
73 de Walt Kornienko - K2WK Internet: waltk at pica.army.mil
DX PacketCluster: K2WK > W3MM (FRC) Packet: K2WK at N2ERH.NJ.USA.NOAM
Ciao for now, and Don't have a cow
_______________________________________________________________________
>From jlarson at micron.net (Jim Larson) Fri Feb 24 19:55:00 1995
From: jlarson at micron.net (Jim Larson) (Jim Larson)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 12:55 MST
Subject: Incomplete exchanges
Message-ID: <m0ri67B-000QYBC at mis01.micron.net>
At 02:31 PM 2/23/95 PST, Larry Tyree wrote:
>N6TR writes:
>
>> >I don't like ENN and probably won't work people who are doing that, but
>> >NN is going too far and isn't an exchange. If you hear this, please
>> >don't support the practice by working them.
>>
>
>KM9P writes:
>
>> I disagree. The RST part of the exchange is meaningless... and this is just
>> another way to abbreviate something on CW. How is this different from 5NN
>> TTT for 599 1000?
>>
>> If I were DX in arrl my exchange would be NNK. That's all.
>
>Wonder what other people think. Am I just a stick in the mud because I
>don't think we should allow NN as an RST?
>
>Tree N6TR
>tree at cmicro.com
>
It comes down to what is the rule. If you need to send an exchange you
need to send the exchange. 99 (nn) is not a full exchange. People are
just trying to bend the rules as far as they can to take any possible
advantage over their competitors.
Why don't we all try to be good fast operators and go by the rules instead
of trying to find cute little tricks that bend the rules in order to gain
an advantage.
Jim - KK7A
----------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Larson internet: jlarson at micron.net
Boise, Idaho
U.S.A.
----------------------------------------------------------------
>From n2ic at drmail.dr.att.com (LondonSM) Fri Feb 24 19:57:14 1995
From: n2ic at drmail.dr.att.com (LondonSM) (LondonSM)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 12:57:14 -0700
Subject: ARRL CW MORE ON 10MTRS
References: <Pine.3.07.9502240645.A25374-b100000 at mailstorm.dot.gov>
Message-ID: <9502241257.ZM1953 at dr.att.com>
On Feb 24, 6:55am, Larry Schimelpfenig wrote:
> Fred K3ZO suggested that I indicate the times that Eur was workable on
> ten.
>
> Sat
> 1433Z TM9C (only Eur I heard Saturday and he was weak)
> 2133Z KL7Y (Not Eur but darn nice mult this time of the cycle)
>
> Sun
> 1441Z IQ4A
> 1447Z 9A1A
> 1451Z I4DZ
> 1453Z 3DA/ND3A
> 1458Z IR2Q
> 1459Z IK6QRH
> 1502Z IK0HBN
> 1504Z GB5AR
> 1510Z II2K
> 1511Z G4BUO
> 1513Z IT9AF
> 1514Z HV3SJ
> 1515Z HG1S
> 1533Z EI7M
> 1537Z EA4KA (Peaked on direct short path)
>
> Band then diasppeared as quickly as it appeared. I heard many other I
> stations that I didn't work. Concentrated on working mults or loud
> stations. With low power, it was a drag getting all the info through to the
> weaker scatter stations.
>
>
>-- End of excerpt from Larry Schimelpfenig
Interesting, but not surprising, from my Colorado perspective. All of your 10
meter EU was worked before there was even a peep on 10 meters out here. In
order to work EU scatter from here, there has to be a darn good Caribbean or
African opening. At 1530Z, there was nothing but weak LU. A bit later (around
16Z), the band opened to Caribbean, but alas, too late for EU scatter.
On the other hand, KL7Y pounded in (S9+20dB) for 3 hours on both days. Haven't
heard that kind of KL7 opening in at least 2 years. No direct JA - JA3ZOH
(2234Z) and JH1HGC (2243Z) on weak scatter Saturday.
Steve, N2IC/0
n2ic at dr.att.com
>From George Cutsogeorge <0006354141 at mcimail.com> Fri Feb 24 20:19:00 1995
From: George Cutsogeorge <0006354141 at mcimail.com> (George Cutsogeorge)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 15:19 EST
Subject: Powerless contacts.
Message-ID: <63950224201936/0006354141PK3EM at MCIMAIL.COM>
When I worked VK9XY and asked for his power he said "No numbers,
I'm not in the contest." Thereby taking more time than just
sending a 3 digit number.
Also, several people were giving out serial numbers.
George W2VJN
>From Hodge Thorgerson David Cameron-INBA <hodge at servidor.unam.mx> Fri Feb 24 20:40:57 1995
From: Hodge Thorgerson David Cameron-INBA <hodge at servidor.unam.mx> (Hodge Thorgerson David Cameron-INBA)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 14:40:57 -0600 (CST)
Subject: C6AHE (K3TLX op) ARRL DX CW Score
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950224143922.1898N-100000 at servidor>
I had very few guys call me more than once per band. Not to say some
folks did not try to work me several times. Wonder if my ATT power and the
faster speed for this part of the exchange helped. Or maybe with such a
LLLLLLOOOOONNNNNNNGGGGGGG call everyone knows who I am! ;-) David 'RX
>From Hodge Thorgerson David Cameron-INBA <hodge at servidor.unam.mx> Fri Feb 24 20:46:04 1995
From: Hodge Thorgerson David Cameron-INBA <hodge at servidor.unam.mx> (Hodge Thorgerson David Cameron-INBA)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 14:46:04 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Incomplete exchanges
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950224144526.1898O-100000 at servidor>
Why don't we just leave out the rst? Now THAT would save some time...
David 'RX
>From Bill Standerfer <bills at hpislwes.lvld.hp.com> Fri Feb 24 20:46:28 1995
From: Bill Standerfer <bills at hpislwes.lvld.hp.com> (Bill Standerfer)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 13:46:28 MST
Subject: Incomplete exchanges
Message-ID: <9502242046.AA19336 at hpislwes.lvld.hp.com>
N6TR writes:
>Wonder what other people think. Am I just a stick in the mud because I
>don't think we should allow NN as an RST?
Being a bit of a purist on such things, I also agree that abrevs shldnt be
allwd. However, if the contest powers that be are going to condone 5NN, then
all the other shortcuts have to be allowed, too. NN, 5NN, and ENN are just as
meaningless as 599 is in a contest. If you force the issue and require real
numbers for the RST, seems like 555 would suddenly become the report of the
day. Perhaps stating that the RST must consist of three characters, the first
of which is a number, would define to what extent abreviations are allowed.
Power could be similarly defined, also allowing KW.
Bill
Bill Standerfer * Hewlett-Packard Company
CFI-A, IA, ME * VXI Systems Division
bills at lvld.hp.com * Loveland, CO 80539
Baron N222AB - KF0DJ - Pikes Peak 253 * 303-679-2378
>From Lau, Zack, KH6CP" <zlau at arrl.org Fri Feb 24 20:45:00 1995
From: Lau, Zack, KH6CP" <zlau at arrl.org (Lau, Zack, KH6CP)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 15:45:00 EST
Subject: Incomplete exchanges
Message-ID: <2F4E4596 at arrl.org>
>On Thu, 23 Feb 1995 fish at crl.com wrote:
>
>> I disagree. The RST part of the exchange is meaningless... and this is
just
>> another way to abbreviate something on CW. How is this different from
5NN
>> TTT for 599 1000?
>>
>> If I were DX in arrl my exchange would be NNK. That's all.
>>
>Maybe we could also send 1,000 instead ok KW.
>
>As Bill et al said, RST is pretty damn meaningless. In fact, in virtually
>all contests, the only thing which means anything is the callsign as
>programs like CT and NA will automatically enter 599 and will usually
>enter CQ zone/country/multiplier based on callsign....
Does this apply to State QSO parties? I used to have an advantage
in the PA QSO party--I knew the counties well enough to easily log them,
as well have an idea on which were the "rare" ones. Great contest--plenty
of stations to work, even for a little QRP station running low wire
antennas.
I've had little working stations the entire time--excepting the forced off
time due to thunderstorms.
One of my personal favorites is the Spring/Fall QRP ARCI contests. Most
of the participants aren't serious contesters--a significant number spend
most of their "amateur radio" time building their radios and get on only
rarely.
This makes for "real" exchanges. I've also found that there are plenty of
weak
signals around the noise floor to dig out--indoor 80 meter dipoles make for
challenging contacts.
Zack KH6CP/1
>From okanep at iol.ie (Paul O'Kane) Fri Feb 24 21:36:06 1995
From: okanep at iol.ie (Paul O'Kane) (Paul O'Kane)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 21:36:06 GMT
Subject: RSGB 7 MHz CW Contest Feb 25/26
Message-ID: <199502242136.VAA03754 at GPO.iol.ie>
Contest logging software specifically for this contest is available from
http://www.iol.ie/~okanep
The file is SD.ZIP (size 233 K). It's complete and unrestricted for
DX entrants to all RSGB HF contests other than the Commonwealth Contest.
It's also complete and unrestricted for DX entrants in the ARRL DX Contest.
Paul O'Kane EI5DI
>From n2ic at drmail.dr.att.com (LondonSM) Fri Feb 24 22:14:30 1995
From: n2ic at drmail.dr.att.com (LondonSM) (LondonSM)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 15:14:30 -0700
Subject: Unacceptable QSO's ??
References: <199502241425.AA19445 at mail.crl.com>
Message-ID: <9502241514.ZM2210 at dr.att.com>
On Feb 24, 6:25am, Bill Fisher, KM9P Concentric Systems, Inc. wrote:
>
> Tom (W2SC) and I were talking off line and he mentioned that he didn't
> consider his QSO with the V44 station a good one since the guy wasn't
> sending a power number with the reports. He and I both asked the guy for
> the power and he gave it to us, but Tom still feels this is not a good QSO
> since it wasn't part of the exchange.
>
> I feel like this is one of those grey areas and wanted to know what everyone
> else does/doesn't do. My guess is he's in all of your logs, as he is in
mine.
>
> Please don't respond to me directly... Like to see this discussed as the
group.
> ---
> Bill Fisher, KM9P - Concentric Systems, Inc.
>
>
>
>-- End of excerpt from Bill Fisher, KM9P Concentric Systems, Inc.
My recollection of the rules says that DX stations must send a signal report
and their power. Where does it say that the "exchange" must be in the exact
form "5NN 1TT". V44KAO sent me his power after I asked for it. As the net
bozos would say "That's a roger contact (sic)".
Steve London, N2IC/0
n2ic at dr.att.com
>From jholly at hposl62.cup.hp.com (Jim Hollenback) Fri Feb 24 22:36:50 1995
From: jholly at hposl62.cup.hp.com (Jim Hollenback) (Jim Hollenback)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 14:36:50 -0800
Subject: ARRL DX Exchange
References: <9502241812.AA25375 at astro.as.utexas.edu>
Message-ID: <9502241436.ZM17993 at hpwsmjh1.cup.hp.com>
On Feb 24, 12:12pm, Derek Wills wrote:
<snip>
> Those Italian ops are still doing great things with their
> 300 watts on the lower bands (snicker).
>
Such a cold heart ... It is the superior Aluminum and steel, no?
Jim, WA6SDM
jholly at cup.hp.com
>From jholly at hposl62.cup.hp.com (Jim Hollenback) Fri Feb 24 23:08:04 1995
From: jholly at hposl62.cup.hp.com (Jim Hollenback) (Jim Hollenback)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 15:08:04 -0800
Subject: Unacceptable QSO's ??
References: <199502241425.AA19445 at mail.crl.com>
Message-ID: <9502241508.ZM17997 at hpwsmjh1.cup.hp.com>
On Feb 24, 6:25am, Bill Fisher, KM9P Concentric Systems, Inc. wrote:
> Subject: Unacceptable QSO's ??
>
> Tom (W2SC) and I were talking off line and he mentioned that he didn't
> consider his QSO with the V44 station a good one since the guy wasn't
> sending a power number with the reports. He and I both asked the guy for
> the power and he gave it to us, but Tom still feels this is not a good QSO
> since it wasn't part of the exchange.
>
> I feel like this is one of those grey areas and wanted to know what everyone
> else does/doesn't do. My guess is he's in all of your logs, as he is in mine.
>
case 1: experienced contester knows the rule, but to cut a corner does
not send power in exchange unless asked. Assumes those listening
copy the power and do not need a 'fill'.
case 2: No-Clue Ragchewer (tm) answers CQ, sez your 599, but doesn't know
exchange. You say POWER?, NCR responds 100.
case 3: Experienced contester sends 599 <QRM QRN QRM>. You send POWER?
Experienced contester sends KW.
No sure I can tell much difference looking at the shadows on the cave wall.
Ethically, the experienced contester in case 1 is in violation of the rules
since he should know what the competition is about and the rules require RST
and power on EVERY exchange. I don't feel the NCR is in violation since he
is stating the lack of knowledge, but wants to comply. The contester in
case 3 is on the envelope, he is really running 1500 watts, and did not
send the power as digits.
Personally, the V44 should be a check log, but I don't think that is going
to happen. I guess I would log the call if the exchange info was sent,
either as one piece or as two separate transmissions (case 2 and 3). I
complied and sent my exchange as required and did get the required info from
the other station. But for the number of fills the guy must have sent, he
probably would been better off doing like it was suppose to happen.
Jim, WA6SDM
jholly at cup.hp.com
>From oo7 at astro.as.utexas.edu (Derek Wills) Fri Feb 24 23:27:37 1995
From: oo7 at astro.as.utexas.edu (Derek Wills) (Derek Wills)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 17:27:37 CST
Subject: Unacceptable QSO's ??
Message-ID: <9502242327.AA12257 at astro.as.utexas.edu>
So what happens if the DX is in CQWW and not sending her zone
because she isn't in the contest? You don't have to ask for
the zone, it's already known. Can you count this?
Baldur turned up as 5X5WR in one CQWW, not giving out his zone,
but I heard plenty of Big Guys calling and working him. When I
asked one of them later why they took time out from contesting
to do some DXing, the op said "Oh, we counted him as 599 37".
Being mainly a contest noodler, I don't have to lie awake
worrying about these things.
Derek AA5BT, G3NMX
oo7 at astro.as.utexas.edu
>From vburns <vburns at netcom.com> Fri Feb 24 23:29:07 1995
From: vburns <vburns at netcom.com> (vburns)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 15:29:07 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Unacceptable QSO's ??
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9502241502.A12710-0100000 at netcom7>
> On Feb 24, 6:25am, Bill Fisher, KM9P Concentric Systems, Inc. wrote:
> >
> > Tom (W2SC) and I were talking off line and he mentioned that he didn't
> > consider his QSO with the V44 station a good one since the guy wasn't
> > sending a power number with the reports. He and I both asked the guy for
> > the power and he gave it to us, but Tom still feels this is not a good QSO
> > since it wasn't part of the exchange.
> >
> > I feel like this is one of those grey areas and wanted to know what everyone
> > else does/doesn't do. My guess is he's in all of your logs, as he is in
> mine.
[STUFF DELETED-IMPERTINENT]
> >
> >-- End of excerpt from Bill Fisher, KM9P Concentric Systems, Inc.
>
> My recollection of the rules says that DX stations must send a signal report
> and their power. Where does it say that the "exchange" must be in the exact
> form "5NN 1TT". V44KAO sent me his power after I asked for it. As the net
> bozos would say "That's a roger contact (sic)".
>
> Steve London, N2IC/0
> n2ic at dr.att.com
Why does every recollect? The rules say a signal report and three
number designator indicating the approximate output power. I do agree
the 59 KW is iffy, but then again, look at all the sketchy
interpretations of the rules in CQWW! 59 999 or 5n nnn or en nnn should
all suffice.
By convention, CW operators use a shorthand ie n for 9 etc. To speed up
the transmission. a nnn is 999 everyone will agree as is 599 the same as
5nn!
If ett works, what's the problem using shorthand for the numeral? And
furthermore, if you need to inquire of a contact not in the contest,
inform them of the correct exchange to confirm, you are pretty damn
patient, especially on CW and probably a better operator than most.
I can't tell you how many guys, especially on 10M SSB, you not only have
to inform them of the correct exchange, many times they are so flustered
you need to actually tell them what state *they* are in. Does that mean
you can't log em? I don't think so!
Victor-KI6IM
V31DX-The Cuba Libre Contest Club.
Contest Globally.....Drink Locally
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