[CQ-Contest] cqcontest.net

kd4d at comcast.net kd4d at comcast.net
Tue Apr 5 15:01:32 EDT 2016 

Actually, the contest sponsors choose it.

73,

Mark, KD4D

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rudy Bakalov" <r_bakalov at yahoo.com>
To: kd4d at comcast.net
Cc: "cq-contest" <cq-contest at contesting.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 1:34:49 PM
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] cqcontest.net

The funny thing is that people pick and chose what unassisted or traditional means. If you want to be hard core and have no assistance then trash your computer and do all logging, dupe checking, multiplier tracking, etc. by hand. If you want to be unassisted then you should use nothing that assists you to achieve a higher score.

You can't have it both ways.

Rudy N2WQ

Sent using a tiny keyboard.  Please excuse brevity, typos, or inappropriate autocorrect.


> On Apr 5, 2016, at 10:01 AM, kd4d at comcast.net wrote:
> 
> Hi Randy:
> 
> It is clear that Radiosport will not follow the model of Golf or bicycle racing - prohibiting use of advanced technologies (e.g., rangefinders and GPS in golf, motors in bicycle racing).  However, I see no reason that the rapidly evolving technology can't coexist with the traditional "single operator" or "unassisted" categories in Radiosport.
> 
> 
> I enjoy using my skills instead of the increasing number of tools and aids available to operate in contests and I like the competition.  The "unassisted" categories in many of the major contests allow me to do this and I don't want to see them removed.  Given the number of entries in these categories, I am not alone.  WRTC restricts the use of many of these technologies.
> 
> Frankly, I don't understand the push to eliminate the more traditional (single operator or unassisted) categories.  Maintaining these categories for those who want them doesn't change the game for those who want to use all of the tools and information available.  The only question is whether we "traditionalists" can compete.
> 
> The future will be interesting.  The "assisted" category will clearly continue to evolve.  It is likely that remote receivers will become commonplace (CQ 160 is permitting them now).  There will be robot "assistants" that hold run frequencies during bathroom breaks.  The digital and CW RBNs will become much more pervasive and accurate.  Tuning knobs will disappear from radios as the radio itself decodes signals and tuning is done by mouse clicks.  There will be fully robotic stations - these will soon be competing in and winning CW and digital contests.  Voice skimmers will appear.
> 
> All of this technology can coexist with traditional "single operator" or "unassisted" categories.  
> 
> 73,
> 
> Mark, KD4D
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Randy Thompson K5ZD" <k5zd at charter.net>
> To: cq-contest at contesting.com
> Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 8:07:34 AM
> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] cqcontest.net
> 
> There is another option...  Rather than continue to get twisted in defining
> the separation, we could merge SO and SOA into one and remove all confusion.
> There could be an overlay category for the guys who want to compare
> themselves to other "classic" ops.
> 
> It seems only CQ, ARRL, and SAC maintain the assisted concept.  The rest of
> the world has moved on.
> 
> Randy, K5ZD
> 
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: CQ-Contest [mailto:cq-contest-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of
>> Paul O'Kane
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 12:26 PM
>> To: cq-contest at contesting.com
>> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] cqcontest.net
>> 
>>> On 05/04/2016 11:54, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
>>> 
>>> Sorry, Ron, but I totally disagree.  If it doesn't *assist* someone to
>>> watch a scoreboard without band breakdown information (and it
>>> doesn't), then it is not *assistance*.
>> 
>> We're going round in circles here with everyone interpreting "assist",
>> "assistance" and "Assisted"
>> as they, personally, think it should be defined.
>> 
>> All relevant technology assists.
>> 
>> The main difference between the "Assisted" and "Unassisted" categories
>> has always been whether you connect to external networks to improve your
>> score or gain a competitive advantage.
>> 
>> That's why, IMHO, the categories should change to Connected and
>> Unconnected.  That would appear to remove most uncertainty and ambiguity.
>> 
>>   * You use the cluster - you're Connected.
>>   * You use the RBN - you're Connected.
>>   * You use real-time scoreboards, or any other
>>     networked technology, to influence or
>>     modify your strategy - you're Connected.
>> 
>> It's really simple - you're either Connected or Unconnected.
>> 
>> I know and accept that local decoders and skimmer- like technology would
>> continue to be "Connected".
>> That's why I referred to "the main difference"
>> above.
>> 
>> 73,
>> Paul EI5DI
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> 73, Pete N4ZR
>>> Download the new N1MM Logger+ at
>>> <http://N1MM.hamdocs.com>. Check
>>> out the Reverse Beacon Network at
>>> <http://reversebeacon.net>, now
>>> spotting RTTY activity worldwide.
>>> For spots, please use your favorite
>>> "retail" DX cluster.
>>> 
>>>> On 4/5/2016 12:52 AM, Fco. Luis Delgadillo wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Enviado desde mi Huawei de Telcel
>>>> Ron
>>>> A couple of questions:
>>>> 
>>>> Have you tried yourself the live scoreboard.
>>>> 
>>>> The Best way to finding  out,  is perhaps, if you try the scoreboard
>>>> and then have an informed opinion - to discern facts from gut
>> feelings?
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Mensaje original --------
>>>> Asunto: Re: [CQ-Contest] cqcontest.net
>>>> De: Ron Notarius W3WN
>>>> Para: 'Pete Smith N4ZR' ,'CQ Contest'
>>>> CC:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    But here's the thing Pete.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    When you receive that information. how did you get it? Where did
>>>>    it come
>>>>    from? You said yourself. "You must decide to post your score" and
>>>> what
>>>>    other information is to be posted for use by other operators.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    So ultimately, the answer is. it came from other operators who are
>>>>    posting
>>>>    that information. How is that not assisted?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    Look, I don't have a problem with the scoreboard or similar
>>>>    exchanges of
>>>>    information. I'm not saying that the software that provides the
>>>>    capability
>>>>    should be disabled.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    Just please don't tell me that it's not "assisted" and using it
>>>>    doesn't put
>>>>    you into an Assisted or equivalent operating category. It is. (Or
>>>>    to put
>>>>    it in the vernacular, don't spill a drink on my slacks and then
>>>>    tell me it's
>>>>    raining.)
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    Sometimes I operate Single Op/Assisted. Sometimes I don't. The
>>>>    reasons why
>>>>    vary depending on the event in question and how I am choosing to
>>>>    approach
>>>>    it. I'm comfortable with either category these days. I just don't
>>>>    pretend
>>>>    one is the other. And I don't ask that the line between them be
>>>>    blurred.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    Either you are assisted. or you aren't. It is that simple.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    73, ron w3wn
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    _____
>>>> 
>>>>    From: Pete Smith N4ZR [mailto:n4zr at contesting.com]
>>>>    Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 4:01 PM
>>>>    To: Ron Notarius W3WN; CQ Contest
>>>>    Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] cqcontest.net
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    Ron, at least in the case of cqcontest.net and users of MM+, this
>>>>    isn't
>>>>    true. You must decideB to post your score, and you can decide (in
>>>> MM+)
>>>>    whether or not to include a band breakdown.B Without band
>>>> information,
>>>>    access to this resource is nothing but fun, and should not be
>>>>    considered
>>>>    assistance.B Perhaps the sponsors could voluntarily disable the
>> band
>>>>    breakdown display during contest weekends, and the whole issue
>>>>    would go
>>>>    away.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    73, Pete N4ZR
>>>>    Download the new N1MM Logger+ at
>>>>    . Check
>>>>    out the Reverse Beacon Network at
>>>>    , now
>>>>    spotting RTTY activity worldwide.
>>>>    For spots, please use your favorite
>>>>    "retail" DX cluster.
>>>> 
>>>>    On 4/4/2016 8:16 AM, Ron Notarius W3WN wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>    ...The scoreboard is directly based on spotting information.
>>>>    Therefore,
>>>>    information derived from it is (IMHO) assistance for the purposes
>>>>    of most
>>>>    contests that recognize this category.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>    ---
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>>> 
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