[CQ-Contest] Allowing self-spotting

W0MU Mike Fatchett w0mu at w0mu.com
Mon Feb 27 18:40:49 EST 2017 

How does an entry get DQed for self spotting when they had no telephone 
or internet access?


On 2/27/2017 10:36 AM, Gerry Hull wrote:
> How about we frame the discussion around "Friends spotting Friends"
>
> This seems very realistic, and matches human nature.
>
> How many of the CQWW DQs are due to friends "cheerleading" by spotting
> their friends multiple times?
> How many are due to :"fake friends" by self-spotters?
>
> Is it really cheating if your friends spot you?  Or is it just jealousy by
> other competitors?   Also, if your friends are in the same country, and
> there is no prop
> on the spotted band, how valuable is the spot?
>
> It is interesting that in VHF and above in ARRL Contests, self spotting is
> encouraged.   In fact, I have a service which allows stations to spot via
> Twitter and a mobile app.
> In the VHF+, it makes sense because unless you know someone is there, you
> might not point the antenna.
>
> And .... a more important question:  How much does cheerleading increase
> the score of those receiving the spots?  Perhaps enough to beat the nearest
> competitor -- but in how many cases is it that tight?
>
> 73, Gerry W1VE
>
>
>
> On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 9:09 AM, Barry <w2up at comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> Doesn't solve the problem for Unassisted stations having "friends" (real
>> or otherwise) spotting them.
>>
>> Barry W2UP
>>
>>
>> On 2/26/2017 05:30, Helmut Mueller wrote:
>>
>>> I don't see the Problem.
>>>
>>> Unassisted = NOT Cluster = No Spots = No Selfspots
>>> Assisted = Allow self spotting
>>>
>>> 73
>>>
>>>     Helmut DF7ZS
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>> Von: CQ-Contest [mailto:cq-contest-bounces at contesting.com] Im Auftrag von
>>> Jukka Klemola
>>> Gesendet: Sunday, 26 February, 2017 10:51 AM
>>> An: Joe <nss at mwt.net>
>>> Cc: cq-contest <cq-contest at contesting.com>
>>> Betreff: Re: [CQ-Contest] Allowing self-spotting
>>>
>>> Sirs,
>>> I have difficulties following this discussion.
>>>
>>> There are people selling the idea to allow self-spotting.
>>>
>>>
>>> Which way are we going:
>>> -allowing CQ calling on internet
>>> -keeping the un-assisted category
>>>
>>> .. or are we developing extreme double.standard or what is going on?
>>>
>>>
>>> A glimpse into the Pandora's box we are now cranking open:
>>> Is a station using CQoIP but claims not using spotting data, is such
>>> entrant
>>> un-assisted?
>>>
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Jukka OH6LI
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 2017-02-26 3:04 GMT+02:00 Joe <nss at mwt.net>:
>>>
>>> I also like this self spotting.
>>>> BUT.....  and there always is a BUT isn't there? I like the three
>>>> QSO's rule, BUT.  there needs to also be a max per hour?
>>>>
>>>> Then gain here we are, back to the same problem, UG!
>>>>
>>>> I can just see someone spotting themself after every q.
>>>>
>>>> Joe WB9SBD
>>>> Sig
>>>> The Original Rolling Ball Clock
>>>> Idle Tyme
>>>> Idle-Tyme.com
>>>> http://www.idle-tyme.com
>>>> On 2/24/2017 4:30 PM, Stan Stockton wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Yes.  This is what I wrote about a year and a half ago:
>>>>> 2015-10-28 4:06 GMT+01:00 Stan Stockton <wa5rtg at gmail.com>:
>>>>> There should be a rule allowing the software to automatically submit
>>>>> a self spot after you have logged perhaps three QSOs on the same
>>>>> frequency - same rule for everyone. After all, when you call CQ on CW
>>>>> you are, in effect, self spotting. There is a huge advantage in being
>>>>> spotted and, on SSB, there is a huge difference in the number of
>>>>> spots for different stations giving advantage to those who are
>>>>> spotted frequently and quickly after a frequency change. 73... Stan,
>>>>> K5GO
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 24, 2017, at 9:49 AM, Steve London <n2icarrl at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On CW, we already have the equivalent of self spotting, thanks to CW
>>>>>> Skimmer and the RBN. It's virtually impossible to NOT be spotted. CW
>>>>>> Skimmer/RBN is the great equalizer - you no longer have to depend on
>>>>>> a network of friends to spot you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We wouldn't be having this discussion if there was a SSB Skimmer.
>>>>>> Right now, we have a system where "those with the right friends"
>>>>>> have an advantage. Why not simply allow self spotting on SSB ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 73,
>>>>>> Steve, N2IC
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 02/22/2017 12:22 PM, Bob Henderson wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Having myself met with unfair and unjustified treatment at the
>>>>>>> hands of RDXC adjudicators I can empathise with those claiming
>>>>>>> unfair treatment in adjudication.  However in this case having
>>>>>>> looked at the information supplied and done a little further
>>>>>>> digging, I am unsure my empathy is justified.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 3V8SS it seems acknowledges cheer-leading by his fellow Tunisians
>>>>>>> KG5OUE and F4HJD but claims not to have encouraged it.  I am
>>>>>>> inclined to believe him, given some of my own friends have spotted
>>>>>>> me during contests and I have NEVER, that is NOT EVER, asked anyone
>>>>>>> to do so.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That said, HB9EOU appears to be rather more than a random contact
>>>>>>> with Switzerland.  Last year HB9EOU operated in the IOTA contest
>>>>>>> from 3V8SM on Djerba Island AF-083 along with F4HJD.  Ash (3V8SS) +
>>>>>>> F4HJD + 3V8CB had activated 3V8SM from Djerba Island a couple of
>>>>>>> months earlier.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The recording of the contact with HB9EOU seems odd, though the
>>>>>>> events not entirely inexplicable but small circles in which the
>>>>>>> same calls crop up repetitively raise questions.  Perhaps it's all
>>>>>>> an extraordinary coincidence but there is enough doubt for me to
>>>>>>> wonder whether my empathy might have been misplaced.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bob, 5B4AGN
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2017 09:48:33 -0600
>>>>>>> From: "Doug Renwick" <ve5ra at sasktel.net>
>>>>>>> To: "'Ashraf Chaabane'" <ash.kf5eyy at gmail.com>, "'cq-contest'"
>>>>>>>            <cq-contest at contesting.com>
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] R: Re: R: 3V8SS disqualified from WW SSB and
>>>>>>>            WRTC
>>>>>>> Message-ID: <E976655BE7DB448B8806659C02036C2C at DOUG8PC>
>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> After reading your post and based on your response to the
>>>>>>> committee, I would conclude that Bob, W5OV; Doug, KR2Q; Scott, W4PA
>>>>>>> are nitpickers with an agenda.
>>>>>>> If anything valid is further introduced to support the committee's
>>>>>>> decision, then I would revise my opinion. As it stands, I believe
>>>>>>> you were unfairly DQd.
>>>>>>> Doug
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: CQ-Contest [mailto:cq-contest-bounces at contesting.com] On
>>>>>>> Behalf Of Ashraf Chaabane
>>>>>>> Sent: February-22-17 7:34 AM
>>>>>>> To: cq-contest
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] R: Re: R: 3V8SS disqualified from WW SSB
>>>>>>> and WRTC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mike, Ria and all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I put online the CC accusations (their native emails) and my
>>>>>>> responses:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.kf5eyy.info/3V8SS_WWSSB16_DQ.htm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think that allows everyone to read from both sides. Now it's up
>>>>>>> to you to comment!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 73
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Ash ~ 3V8SS/KF5EYY
>>>>>>> http://www.kf5eyy.info/
>>>>>>> Phone/SMS: (+216) 22670026
>>>>>>> Skype: kf5eyy
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> CQ-Contest mailing list
>>>>>>> CQ-Contest at contesting.com
>>>>>>> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>
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