[CQ-Contest] FT8 not allowed in Winter Field Day?
Jeff Stai
wk6i.jeff at gmail.com
Thu Jan 17 14:38:51 EST 2019
The ARRL didn't have to change the rules for the Roundup either, but they
provided advice to ensure that entrants followed the overall rules properly
(eg Fox&Hound would not have been within the rules), and so that FT8
activity could be gauged. They had the lead time to do this for Roundup and
I think their proactive approach here benefited all everyone.
I have an impression that FT8 happened for June FD simply because it could
and no one said it couldn't, but I'm sure someone will try and correct this
impression. I wouldn't hold it against the WFD to not want to issue the
necessary rules clarifications and to take a wait and see position.
Have fun - 73 jeff wk6i
On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 10:41 AM Amir Findling <sarlabs at gmail.com> wrote:
> True, ARRL did not have to change the field day rules for FT8, yet they
> did change them for the RTTY Roundup.
>
> Exclusion is not the way. Winter Field Day organizers better learn their
> lesson.
>
> As for my preparedness, I have a nice winter storm coming... That will be
> my winter exercise, and if/when WFD will change their ways, I may
> reconsider, till then, adios!
>
>
>
> --
>
> 73 de Amir K9CHP
>
> ARRL, Emergency Coordinator, Onondaga County, NY
> Radio Amateurs of Greater Syracuse www.ragsclub.org
> Wilderness SAR www.wsar.org (ret.)
> Eagle Valley Search Dogs www.evdogs.org (ret.)
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 17, 2019, 12:12 Bruce Blain <bruce.blain at charter.net wrote:
>
> > Amir,
> >
> >
> >
> > ARRL did not alter their field day rules to support FT8. WSJT-X did.
> WFD
> > might be a newcomer, but so is FT8. The sponsors of WFD asked WSJT to
> > support WFD, and my understanding is that they were told it would happen.
> > It didn’t. You shouldn’t “dump” on the sponsors of WFD. They have
> nothing
> > against FT8. None. It’s easy to converse with JS8-Call (which is
> modified
> > FT8 to overcome the limitations FT8 has), and JS8-Call QSOs are allowed.
> >
> >
> >
> > The sponsors of WFD want people to be prepared for a winter emergency,
> and
> > they want them to get out in the field in the cold weather. I’d like to
> > see that as the positive focus of this discussion, not making accusations
> > that have limited merit.
> >
> >
> >
> > I hope you find a lot of other people using FT8 that are participating in
> > WFD. Make sure you get their correct exchanges in the log. And submit
> > your score.
> >
> >
> >
> > Bruce, K1BG
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *From:* Amir Findling [mailto:sarlabs at gmail.com]
> > *Sent:* Thursday, January 17, 2019 10:57 AM
> > *To:* bruce.blain at charter.net
> > *Cc:* cq-contest; Radio K0HB; Neil Johnson; Sean Waite;
> rjairam at gmail.com
> > *Subject:* Re: [CQ-Contest] FT8 not allowed in Winter Field Day?
> >
> >
> >
> > Winter field day is a newcomer to the field. A bit of massaging of the
> > rules to allow FT8, and perhaps creating multipliers that favor modes
> more
> > appropriate for emergency operations, would have included FT8 users.
> >
> >
> >
> > They chose to exclude us, too bad, I'll be on FT8.
> >
> >
> >
> > BTW, setting up a field FT8 station is the same basic work as setting an
> > FLdigi station, so there would have been good relevant training there...
> > So really it was just adapting rules... Bad move, I bet the ARRL field
> > day will see growth like they have never seen.
> >
> > --
> >
> > 73 de Amir K9CHP
> >
> > ARRL, Emergency Coordinator, Onondaga County, NY
> > Radio Amateurs of Greater Syracuse www.ragsclub.org
> > Wilderness SAR www.wsar.org (ret.)
> > Eagle Valley Search Dogs www.evdogs.org (ret.)
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 17, 2019, 10:02 Bruce Blain <bruce.blain at charter.net wrote:
> >
> > Amir,
> >
> > Before I go out on a cold winter day to participate in winter field day,
> > please share with everyone how you would make a winter field day contact
> > using FT8. To my knowledge, the latest version of FT8 (really WSJT-X
> 2.0)
> > only supports message formats for North American VHF contests, European
> VHF
> > contests, ARRL Field Day, and ARRL RTTY Roundup. I've tried it, and I'm
> > stumped!
> >
> > To my knowledge, there is no support for WFD, and no way to add it.
> > Please share with us how you would accomplish this, before I set up in
> the
> > snow.
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Bruce, K1BG
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: CQ-Contest [mailto:cq-contest-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of
> > Amir Findling
> > Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2019 8:26 AM
> > To: rjairam at gmail.com
> > Cc: Radio K0HB; Neil Johnson; cq-contest; Sean Waite
> > Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] FT8 not allowed in Winter Field Day?
> >
> > Hi there,
> > We are ham radio operators, communicators, not excommunicators! No
> > reason to ban a mode! Changes can be made to the rules to adapt to the
> > limitations of FT8, and while making these changes add a multiplier
> factor
> > so that modes that are more appropriate to emergencies would be favored,
> > but FT8 users would not be excluded.
> >
> >
> >
> > I had intended to participate in the winter field day, in a minor way,
> > now I'm not going to. They dislike a mode that many are using nowadays
> to
> > the point of banning it, I will reply with a boycott of winter field
> day
> > on all modes!
> >
> > --
> >
> > 73 de Amir K9CHP
> >
> > ARRL, Emergency Coordinator, Onondaga County, NY
> > Radio Amateurs of Greater Syracuse www.ragsclub.org
> > Wilderness SAR www.wsar.org (ret.)
> > Eagle Valley Search Dogs www.evdogs.org (ret.)
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 15, 2019, 16:17 rjairam at gmail.com <rjairam at gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > > In that case I think I'll stick to summer field day, then. There is a
> > > vocal anti-FT8 contingent. I choose to boycott them if they are
> > > hostile to a mode that for some has meant the difference between
> > > making contacts and simply packing up and finding another hobby.
> > >
> > > 73
> > > Ria, N2RJ
> > >
> > > On Tue, 15 Jan 2019 at 11:16, Radio K0HB <kzerohb at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Darn! I mis-spoke!
> > > >
> > > > FT8 is not allowed as stated at the top of the rules.
> > > >
> > > > K0HB
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 08:34 Radio K0HB <kzerohb at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> I just read the rules.
> > > >>
> > > >> As far as I can see, the FT8 mode is not specifically banned.
> > > >>
> > > >> If you can send and receive the required “contest exchange”, go
> ahead
> > > and use it.
> > > >>
> > > >> DISCLAIMER: I am not a member of the WFD rules committee, and I do
> not
> > > play one on TV.
> > > >>
> > > >> 73, de Hans, K0HB
> > > >> “Just a Boy and his Radio”™
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> .
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 08:23 rjairam at gmail.com <rjairam at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Why?
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Is telemetry not an important capability we can use? This is a very
> > > >>> practical possible application of WSJT modes. Furthermore even by
> > > >>> itself modes like WSPR can help us automatically measure
> propagation
> > > >>> to measure capabilities of our stations, i.e. determining when the
> > > >>> band opens and closes at our location. You can even do that in FT8
> > > >>> where a wider variety of signals from various places arrive at our
> > > >>> antennas. And even going further, as mentioned, JS8Call takes FT8
> all
> > > >>> the way to a full conversational mode.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> There are hams now who are saying "FT8 is not real radio because
> it's
> > > >>> computers talking to one another" or "it requires no skill." To
> that
> > I
> > > >>> say, nonsense. As hams we have found new ways to communicate over
> the
> > > >>> years. We should embrace this sort of progress.
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> 73
> > > >>> Ria, N2RJ
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 at 22:42, Radio K0HB <kzerohb at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > That makes good sense to me.
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > Communications modes in an emergency situation must be able to
> > carry
> > > a
> > > >>> > payload of information. The mode must be robust enough to carry
> a
> > > payload
> > > >>> > beyond “R-17” and “RR73”.
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > 73, de Hans, K0HB
> > > >>> > “Just a Boy and his Radio”™
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 15:38 Sean Waite <waisean at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > > One comment that was suggested in a thread elsewhere was that
> > > Field Day is
> > > >>> > > about being able to test out our ability to deploy in
> "emergency"
> > > >>> > > situations. FT8 cannot really be used in this type of situation
> > > because of
> > > >>> > > it's limited vocabulary.
> > > >>> > >
> > > >>> > > Sean WA1TE
> > > >>> > >
> > > >>> > > On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 3:44 PM Neil Johnson via CQ-Contest <
> > > >>> > > cq-contest at contesting.com> wrote:
> > > >>> > >
> > > >>> > > > Just curious as to why the sudden rules change?
> > > >>> > > >
> > > >>> > > > https://www.winterfieldday.com/rules
> > > >>> > > >
> > > >>> > > > D-Star and Fusion contacts are allowed why not FT8?
> > > >>> > > >
> > > >>> > > >
> > > >>> > > > --
> > > >>> > > > Neil Johnson (N0SFH)
> > > >>> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > >>> > > > CQ-Contest mailing list
> > > >>> > > > CQ-Contest at contesting.com
> > > >>> > > > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
> > > >>> > > >
> > > >>> > > --
> > > >>> > >
> > > >>> > > Sent from my Motorola DynaTAC 8000X
> > > >>> > > _______________________________________________
> > > >>> > > CQ-Contest mailing list
> > > >>> > > CQ-Contest at contesting.com
> > > >>> > > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
> > > >>> > >
> > > >>> > --
> > > >>> > 73, de Hans, K0HB
> > > >>> > --
> > > >>> > "Just a boy and his radio"™
> > > >>> > _______________________________________________
> > > >>> > CQ-Contest mailing list
> > > >>> > CQ-Contest at contesting.com
> > > >>> > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
> > > >>
> > > >> --
> > > >> 73, de Hans, K0HB
> > > >> --
> > > >> "Just a boy and his radio"™
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > 73, de Hans, K0HB
> > > > --
> > > > "Just a boy and his radio"™
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > CQ-Contest mailing list
> > > CQ-Contest at contesting.com
> > > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
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> >
> >
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--
Jeff Stai ~ WK6I ~ wk6i.jeff at gmail.com
Ask me about Green Keys Night - Jan 1, 2019 0000-2359 UTC!
RTTY op at W7RN
Twisted Oak Winery ~ http://www.twistedoak.com/
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