[CQ-Contest] Self spot in ARRL DX

Mon Feb 5 12:56:44 EST 2024

Stan, thanks for the followup. You made some interesting valid points, such
that I now realize I am in the wrong league. Plus, this thread has now
shifted.

I am just an old guy playing with his radios (always low power) and
antennas trying to keep the playing field as level as possible in the
unassisted category where I compete. I still enjoy the thrill of making
QSOs and finding mults by either running, or S&P using the radio’s tuning
knob. For the first time, I managed a clean sweep in the NovSS Phone
without any assistance *initiated by me*. I don’t know if I got spotted by
any friends or not.

73 & High Rates,

Henry - K4TMC

On Sun, Feb 4, 2024 at 2:25 PM Stan Stockton <wa5rtg at gmail.com> wrote:

> Henry,
>
> No one said complaints were particularly from those in unassisted
> category, did they?
>
>
>  It seems so unethical to gain some assistance while declaring to be
> unassisted.
>
>
> You consider self spotting  “some assistance” but don’t think my buddy
> spotting me every time I change frequency is assistance?
>
> Assistance has always been defined pretty much as using something other
> than your own senses to provide callsigns and frequencies for stations you
> can go work.  Alternating CQs on two bands, running people in 2BSIQ mode at
> roughly 70% faster than you could ever do it on one band isn’t assistance,
> nor is being spotted by your friends and now by yourself in case you don’t
> have any friends.
>
> Personally I don’t see this as such a big deal.  It takes some amount of
> luck out of the equation.  Certainly those in the assisted category don’t
> mind having more spots to click on - right? And  those in unassisted
> category are now on a roughly level field regarding their frequency being
> known, if they want it to be known.
>
> Under the old rules If you were competing against someone in any category
> and they “happened” to get spotted within a minute or two every time they
> fired up on a frequency and you never got spotted within 20 minutes of
> starting on a frequency, you probably wouldn’t like it.
>
> 73…Stan, K5GO
>
>
> On Feb 4, 2024, at 9:52 AM, Henry Pollock - K4TMC <kilo4tmc at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> 
>
> Re “…people complaining after the contest that so and so had all his
> friends spot him while I didn’t get any spots from my friends.”
>
>
> Wow…did we really have that many people who were operating *unassisted*
> complaining about not getting spotted? If so, in my opinion, there is
> something wrong with this scenario. It seems so unethical to gain some
> assistance while declaring to be unassisted. As someone noted earlier in
> this thread – it’s like calling CQ with another radio.
>
> When I operate unassisted I already know that I am at a disadvantage
> versus those who are assisted, relative to score total.
>
> Why not limit self-spotting to only those in the assisted and unlimited
> categories?
>
>
> If this battle is lost...Going forward, I would like to see the numbers of
> those in the unassisted category who self-spotted, maybe add in their
> Soapbox comments - 'SSPT'.
>
>
> Looking forward to ARRL DX SSB.
>
>
> 73,
>
> Henry - K4TMC
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 3, 2024 at 11:03 PM Stan Stockton <wa5rtg at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The question was whether everyone in every category could self spot or
>> why allow everyone to self spot.
>>
>> The answer is that it makes it more nearly fair for everyone versus
>> people complaining after the contest that so and so had all his friends
>> spot him while I didn’t get any spots from my friends.  If everyone has an
>> equal opportunity to let it be known what frequency they are calling CQ on,
>> it seems fair.
>>
>> I made a comparison that you are in effect self spotting just by calling
>> CQ on CW because you will be spotted on RBN assuming you have an antenna
>> connected.  If some are not seeing the RBN spots, I don’t see it as a flaw
>> in allowing self spotting but instead an even more desirable thing!  If
>> someone isn’t looking at RBN spots, but looking at DX Summit in a contest,
>> he will be calling those who have their friends spotting them and not be
>> calling those who didn’t have friends spot them.  If everyone can self
>> spot, he is as likely to call one as the other.
>>
>> Self spotting on CW ensures that regardless of whether the assisted S&P
>> operators are only looking at DX Summit type spots or whether they are only
>> looking at RBN spots or a combination of the two, they will know where
>> everyone who is serious is located.
>>
>> It is not surprising there is a big difference between the number of
>> callers when you have a real spot versus just an RBN spot, especially in a
>> non contest environment like people working some 1x1 callsign on a Tuesday
>> night.  If I were to turn the radio on for a few minutes when there is not
>> a contest going on I would never open N1MM and connect to a cluster.
>> Instead I would filter DX Summit for 20m CW, for example, and see what’s on.
>>
>> Stan, K5GO
>>
>> > On Feb 3, 2024, at 12:44 PM, Tim Shoppa <tshoppa at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Stan, only a fraction of cluster telnet nodes in the widely circulated
>> > public cluster node lists include RBN spots.
>> >
>> > Veteran contesters know that RBN spots are where it's at for CW or RTTY,
>> > but a more casual ham may not know this. They may have tried a dozen
>> > different cluster nodes and not found one - or not known how to enable -
>> > the RBN spots.
>> >
>> > Tim N3QE
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>>
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