[RFI] UPDATE re: Source power pole located - but wonder which components most likely temperature sensitive

Sat Feb 3 18:45:39 EST 2024

Charlie, and all,
   I have spent a lot of hours with the Pacific Power’s contract guys riding along in their rigs. I can say this, In the Central Oregon area about 90% or more of the Radio interferences on 160 and 80 meters  found here are caused in the pole to pole or pole or pole to ground wires system and not the high tension lines. Some of our lines are quite old and continually get upgraded. Usually loose bolts or 2 pieces of metal very close to one another with no literal connection arcing to each other. One particular hard to find occurrence here was a single long bolt through the crossarm too close to one of the 45 degree braces holding that crossarm to the pole. Found first with 225 MHz and then identified as the bolt by Ultrasonic. Pole back stay cables are often involved in that ground system especially if accidentally touching another cable.
    For my purposes I find that RF receivers are the best at getting very close to an offender. I use from AM broadcast up to 450 MHz for initial finds and then try my own design of ultrasonic with an Edmund scientific 12 inch parabolic dish. The ultrasonic is OK for refining down to particular hardware on a find but you cannot detect any area you cannot see for small arcs. As an aside we have a lot of Cheat Grass here and when dry in a breeze overpowers the ultrasonic at 43KHz in our dry summer climate.
  Its just like low band receiving, one can never have enough interference locating tools or receiving antennas.
Lee   K7TJR  OR

From: charlie at thegallos.com <charlie at thegallos.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 3, 2024 12:54 PM
To: 'Michael Martin' <mike at rfiservices.com>
Cc: 'Lee STRAHAN' <k7tjr at msn.com>; 'Rfi List' <rfi at contesting.com>
Subject: RE: [RFI] UPDATE re: Source power pole located - but wonder which components most likely temperature sensitive

Nah, I’m buying the drone for OTHER reasons (Lost pet finding, help with SAR) – but was wondering if nosie fining would work.  I know others in the field who are doing power line inspections for the power company (HV Lines).  So it seems that for noise, basically useless – that is OK, was just a “It would be nice if it did”

From: Michael Martin <mike at rfiservices.com<mailto:mike at rfiservices.com>>
Sent: Saturday, February 3, 2024 9:11 AM
To: charlie at thegallos.com<mailto:charlie at thegallos.com>
Cc: Lee STRAHAN <k7tjr at msn.com<mailto:k7tjr at msn.com>>; Rfi List <rfi at contesting.com<mailto:rfi at contesting.com>>
Subject: Re: [RFI] UPDATE re: Source power pole located - but wonder which components most likely temperature sensitive

Charlie I'm sorry I don't have time to write I really thorough and long response to your post. However, if you're purchasing and I are camera for the use of Powerline noise you'll be wishing your money. It is not economically feasible. I have been out with many infrared camera sales people and Corona can people. I challenge them in a neighborhood that I don't frequent and I tell them to find every Source they can find in the neighborhood. I go out and I find every Power Line noise in the neighborhood. We spend a couple of hours doing this and come back and compare them. Rarely is there more than one source that are matching. Most power line noises are created by very small sparks. It's unfortunate as most amateur radio operators want to explain to the power companies that these are all catastrophic failures and due to a lack of maintenance. That is just not factual. The Sparks that create most of the power line noises do not create Heat because of the lack of current flow. Most sources are induced voltage into hardware near the primary conductor. As for ultrasound it works wonderful however it's direct line of sight capabilities inhibit finding a lot of the sources that are internal such as Lightning restors Arc through insulation and conductors and things like that. I read most of the input on this reflector and I wish I had time to comment on everything but I don't. I spend just about every day locating Powerline noise for power companies all over the country and I just can't find the time to reply to post that I'd like to because I'm too busy finding noise. I use ultrasound and RF every day I use the UE and the radar engineers. The radar Engineers is the best piece of equipment out there and in no way should anyone think they're going to find the average Source 200 ft away or even 60 ft away. The average power line noise from Hardware to ground is typically no more than about 50 ft. On the average! I find over 90% of my sources using ultrasound. Sometimes those sources are determined because I can't receive it with ultrasound and that helps to point toward the source as well as being able to hear it. And for red is not a good tool for finding Powerline resources. My experience does not come from taking a class and being certified. My experience comes from actually doing it and time and time again finding the source a lot of times repairing it myself to get a total understanding of why it happens as well as a lot of lab reconstruction.
 Best wishes to everybody.

Michael Martin
RFI Services
51 W Bay Front Rd
Lothian, MD 20711

240-508-3760
mike at rfiservices.com<mailto:mike at rfiservices.com>
www.rfiservices.com<http://www.rfiservices.com/>

On Fri, Feb 2, 2024, 7:02 PM Charlie at thegallos.com<mailto:Charlie at thegallos.com> <charlie at thegallos.com<mailto:charlie at thegallos.com>> wrote:
Now here is the question. I know they do IR surveys of the power lines (about to go for the class, yes I have my part 107)
Does anyone know if power line noise sources on the lower voltage stuff actually shows in IR? As I’m probably going to be buying a thermal drone (probably a M3T), might be a good tool to add
—
Charlie
73 de KG2V
Http://www.thegallos.com<http://www.thegallos.com/>

> On Feb 2, 2024, at 1:33 PM, Lee STRAHAN <k7tjr at msn.com<mailto:k7tjr at msn.com>> wrote:
>
>    Hi Charlie and all,
>  John Fluke company has some new equipment that senses IR and I believe they add ultrasonic for their new remarkable sensor capable of use with power lines.
> " https://www.fluke.com/en-us/products/thermal-cameras"
>     A bit on the spendy side. I remember their new product announcement showing power line use but do not recall their specific product numbers.
>  Searching their site.
>  I Found this.  " https://www.fluke.com/en-us/learn/blog/leak-detection/corona-discharge"   It's an ii900 from Fluke
> Lee K7TJR  OR.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: RFI <rfi-bounces+k7tjr=msn.com at contesting.com<mailto:msn.com at contesting.com>> On Behalf Of Charles Gallo
> Sent: Friday, February 2, 2024 7:42 AM
> To: Rfi List <rfi at contesting.com<mailto:rfi at contesting.com>>
> Subject: Re: [RFI] UPDATE re: Source power pole located - but wonder which components most likely temperature sensitive
>
> I know HV lines are surveyed with drones in at least some locations. Usually the company applies for a “beyond visual line of sight” (BVLOS) waver, and they use drones with thermal imaging and CM accuracy for location
> --
> 73 de KG2V
> Charlie
>
>> On Feb 2, 2024, at 10:28 AM, Alan Higbie <alan.higbie at gmail.com<mailto:alan.higbie at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> 
>> *I'M CURIOUS*:
>>
>>  - Is there some new technology being used for surveying lines?  I sort
>>  of recall reading something like this. Drones? SDR recording?
>>  - Or, maybe this is just some guy driving around with his AM radio on?
>>  - Is there a new version of the ultrasonic dish that is better than the
>>  previous Radar Engineers model?
>>  - What is the difference between RE models and the MFJ-5008?
>>
>> https://mfjen/
>> terprises.com<http://terprises.com/>%2Fproducts%2Fmfj-5008&data=05%7C02%7C%7C416b4c251bef4ede
>> d11108dc24059682%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C63842485
>> 3636490497%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzI
>> iLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=1y2NbTZ5VnjgayxM9A%
>> 2FBNgfhX%2FYWfplde66glt%2BDRhg%3D&reserved=0
>>
>> I will further update when these tickets are closed out - and the
>> defective component is positively identified.
>>
>> 73, ~ Alan K0AV
>> Colorado Springs
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>
>
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