[RTTY] Tinyfsk, 2Tone and USOS

Mark n2qt n2qt.va at gmail.com
Mon Sep 28 19:51:33 EDT 2015 

But when this happened to me, I'd hover the cursor over the offending text and it 
didn't resolve to the correct letters, so I think it's something more than just a LTR/FIG
shift issue.  

Mark. N2QT

> On Sep 28, 2015, at 1:21 PM, Dave Hachadorian <k6ll.dave at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I'm glad this thread has migrated to the RTTY Reflector, because there are a lot of smart guys here who can weigh in.  I can think of only one logical path to explain the reported behavior.
> 
> First of all, USOS on TX and RX is the Ham standard.  Everybody should be set up this way.
> 
> When you send 599-NY-NY, the following is sent, regardless if USOS on TX is enabled.
> 599(dash)(LTRS)NY(FIGS)(dash)(LTRS)NY
> There are no spaces here, so a decoder will work even if USOS on the decoder is disabled.
> 
> Now, here is my hypothesis of the difference between TinyFSK and MMTTY on transmit.  This is based only on Occam’s Razor, and not any scientific measurements.
> 
> When you send 599 NY NY
> TinyFSK must be sending (FIGS)599(space)NY(space)NY.  This works fine if USOS is enabled on RX, as it should be.
> 
> MMTTY must be sending (FIGS)599(space)(LTRS)NY(space)NY
> The added (LTRS) is unnecessary if the receiving party has properly enabled USOS, but also works in the disabled case.
> 
> How would one go about verifying this empirically?
> 
> Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
> Yuma, AZ
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Charles Lind 
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2015 6:02 AM 
> To: Mark n2qt 
> Cc: V. Sidarau ; RTTY contest group 
> Subject: Re: [RTTY] Tinyfsk, 2Tone and USOS 
> 
> I did some experimenting:  Using Writelog or N1MM+ with a macro "599 05 NY
> NY" sending with 2Tone/Tinyfsk.......a second rig (756 Pro) set up with
> plain vanilla MMTTY receives "599 05 ,6 ,6".  To get proper receive the
> MMTTY USOS button must be manually depressed.  Copy on the 756 Pro decode
> window is always correct.  Inserting hyphens into the macro corrects
> things.  Switching out to a simple transistor interface sending via MMTTY
> always gives correct print on the remote receive rig, whether or not the
> USOS button is depressed.  I would suggest that if Vlad and Mark--and I'm
> sure all those hams who asked for state repeats--are seeing this odd print,
> that there is something going on with the Tinyfsk interface.
> 
> Chuck, N8CL
> 
>> On Mon, Sep 28, 2015 at 1:25 AM, Mark n2qt <n2qt.va at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Yes I saw this also.  Seemed like 2tone decoded ok, but mmtty didn't.  Not
>> just reversed.
>> Yet another thing to watch for
>> 
>> Mark. N2QT
>> 
>>> On Sep 27, 2015, at 8:21 PM, V. Sidarau <vs_otw at rogers.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Whatever it is, this time around I have had a few guys sending like :5
>> and
>>> 5/ instead of TX time by time.
>>> 
>>> 73,
>>> 
>>> Vlad VE3IAE
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: RTTY [mailto:rtty-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of David G3YYD
>>> Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2015 4:04 PM
>>> To: 'Charles Lind'
>>> Cc: rtty at contesting.com
>>> Subject: Re: [RTTY] Tinyfsk, 2Tone and USOS
>>> 
>>> Like I said TinyFSK sets the shift pattern not 2Tone. As you have the
>> source
>>> code can always modify it. Personally I always use 2Tone DOOK.
>>> 
>>> 73 David
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: RTTY [mailto:rtty-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Charles
>> Lind
>>> Sent: 27 September 2015 19:50
>>> To: David G3YYD
>>> Cc: reflector RTTY
>>> Subject: Re: [RTTY] Tinyfsk, 2Tone and USOS
>>> 
>>> I just swapped out interfaces and put in an FSKit with MMTTY on transmit
>> and
>>> receive, and removed all the dashes.  The clone window prints "05 ny ny"
>> OK,
>>> with and without the USOS button pushed, and I get no requests for
>> repeats.
>>> Back to Tinyfsk/2Tone on transmit again i see "05 ny ny" misprint in the
>>> MMTTY clone--if the USOS is not pushed-- and some stations request
>> repeats.
>>> As it stands, with Tinyfsk /2Tone I need dashes in the macros to avoid a
>> lot
>>> of repeats.
>>> 
>>> 73, Chuck, N8CL
>>> 
>>>> On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 7:14 PM, David G3YYD <g3yyd at btinternet.com>
>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Chuck
>>>> 
>>>> 2Tone sends ITA5 characters that have a ITA2 translation to TinyFSK (&
>>>> rpiFSK same interface). All characters that do not have a ITA2
>>>> equivalent are ignored. The USOS is part of the TinyFSK in this case
>>>> 
>>>> The distant end needs to turn on USOS as the vast majority of RTTY
>>>> users have USOS on.
>>>> 
>>>> 2Tone has USOS turned on for RX and FSK/AFSK/DOOK TX. There is no way
>>>> to turn it off either. Deliberate policy on my part to ensure USOS is
>>>> used as it significantly reduces the chance of being int he wrong shift.
>>>> 
>>>> 73 David G3YYD
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: RTTY [mailto:rtty-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Charles
>>>> Lind
>>>> Sent: 27 September 2015 17:58
>>>> To: rtty at contesting.com
>>>> Subject: [RTTY] Tinyfsk, 2Tone and USOS
>>>> 
>>>> I was trying out a new Tinyfsk interface with Writelog and 2Tone as
>>>> the transmit modem, and had numerous requests for repeats of the state
>>>> in the macro "599 05 ny ny", and noticed that ny was not printing
>>>> properly in an MMTTY clone window.  Hitting the USOS button in the
>>>> MMTTY clone window made "ny" print in the clone window, but not for
>>>> the hams trying to get my message.  Adding dashes "599 05-ny-ny"  did
>>>> the job, but I have not had this problem in the past with other
>>>> interfaces (two transistor and FSKit) using MMTTY.  Is this a property
>>>> unique to 2Tone and/or Tinyfsk?
>>>> 
>>>> Tnx, Chuck, N8CL
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