[TenTec] notch filter for Eagle?

Kim Elmore cw_de_n5op at sbcglobal.net
Fri Jul 21 22:35:15 EDT 2017 

In thought it was the stupid antenna... 😜

73,

Kim N5OP

"People that make music together cannot be enemies, at least as long as the music lasts." -- Paul Hindemith

> On Jul 21, 2017, at 17:13, rick at dj0ip.de <Rick at DJ0IP.de> wrote:
> 
> Oh I agree, Darrell.
> I just would have preferred to pay $100 more and have the pre-selection
> built-in.
> But since the whole world doesn't need it, just Europe, I understand why
> they did it the way they did.
> 
> Of course those running Multi-Multi contests need it too, regardless of
> where on this planet they are.
> 
> No complaints here, just stating some facts which no one else seems to
> mention.
> 
> After some long discussions with Rob Sherwood on Cost Of Ownership (COO), I
> set a stake in the ground and said I am simply not going to pay more than
> 2000 EUR for any radio.  that rules out the 7610 for me, even though it is
> probably worth the money and I would dearly love to own one.  I just don't
> use any ham radio that much.  
> 
> Since retiring from work and from serious contesting, I don't want to spend
> so much money on a radio.
> 
> After all,  "IT'S THE ANTENNA, STUPID"  (hi)
> 
> 73
> Rick, DJ0IP
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TenTec [mailto:tentec-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Darrell
> Bellerive
> Sent: Friday, July 21, 2017 5:39 PM
> To: tentec at contesting.com
> Subject: Re: [TenTec] notch filter for Eagle?
> 
> Rick,
> 
> From the rumour mill, the upcoming Icom IC-7610 direct sampling radio will
> have much better bandpass filtering than the IC-7300. Until it is generally
> available though, I would not believe any of the rumours. Also the price of
> the IC-7610 will most likely be much higher than the combined price of the
> IC-7300 and the outboard preselector.
> 
> The other thing to consider is that the radios in your comparison, the
> Orion/Eagle/K3 were all much higher priced than the IC-7300. (The Eagle fire
> sale prices being the exception.) Perhaps a fairer comparison may be the
> Orion/Eagle/K3 with the IC-7610.
> 
> We are again at one of those points in amateur radio where we are seeing a
> big shift, like the spark gap/carrier shift, the AM/SSB/transceiver shift,
> the Japanese hybrids, synthesizers, dsp, and now direct sampling. 
> Look at what Apache Labs are doing with the ANAN products. Their have broken
> through the ceiling on transmitter IMD, reducing it by orders of magnitude.
> 
> I expect that in the next few years we are going to see some amazing new
> radios.
> 
> 73, Darrell  VE7IU
> 
> 
>> On 17-07-20 11:19 PM, rick at dj0ip.de wrote:
>> Darell, you are spot on in your description.
>> 
>> I will add that Scott (W4PA) offers an INRAD option to the 7300 that
> enables you to insert a preselector...
>> 
>> And there is a guy in Greece producing a preselector ("assembled board but
> kit" because you must add the band switch and the cabinet).  It is only
> missing the 60m band.
>> See: https://www.sv1afn.com/ham_band_presel.html
>> Legally it's a kit but there's not much to do to get it to work.
>> Obviously this was to avoid FCC and CE approval hassles.
>> 
>> So with those two add-ons, the problem is solved for us Europeans.
>> 
>> It just bothers me a bit that after 30 years of needing a preselector,
> then finally storing them away when the Orion/Eagle/K3 came along, we're
> back to needing the preselector again.
>> 
>> Which just goes to show ya, you still can't have your cake and eat it too!
>> 
>> 73
>> Rick, DJ0IP
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Darrell Bellerive [mailto:ve7iu at runbox.com]
>> Sent: Friday, July 21, 2017 12:28 AM
>> To: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment
>> Cc: rick at dj0ip.de
>> Subject: Re: [TenTec] notch filter for Eagle?
>> 
>> It is really hard to beat the value of the IC-7300. It is not perfect, but
> considering the features, performance, audio quality, and ergonomics at its
> price point, it is tough to beat.
>> 
>> Not only is there a manual notch filter, but there are three width
> settings for the manual notch: wide, mid, or narrow. I am not sure what the
> those settings correspond to in Hertz though.
>> 
>> When I purchased my Eagle, my choice was between the Eagle, the Kenwood
> TS-590S, and the Elecraft K3. At that time there were no TS-590SG or K3S
> models.
>> 
>> I chose the Eagle because of its performance edge over the TS-590S. I do
> not care for the ergonomics or audio of the K3. And the K3 was more
> expensive.
>> 
>> Today, I would choose the IC-7300. I am fortunate to live in an area that
> is not plagued by nearby high powered transmitters, so the lack of bandpass
> filtering in the IC-7300 is not a big factor for me.
>> 
>> At the price point of the IC-7300, with its performance, features, audio
> quality, and ergonomics, it is tough to beat. The TS-590SG does come close,
> but it is older technology, and the issues Kenwood has had with the fans
> being installed backwards and not starting at low speed, worries me that
> Kenwood's quality may not be what it used to be.
>> 
>> 73, Darrell VE7IU
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 17-07-20 02:45 PM, rick at dj0ip.de wrote:
>>> Now that's super, Darrell!
>>> I haven't used one yet, only looked at it at the ham fest in 
>>> Friedrichshafen.
>>> I didn't see the manual notch.
>>> 
>>> It's beginning to look like the 7300 is the only radio left out there 
>>> to buy.
>>> All others are for rock collectors or computer geeks! (hi)
>>> 
>>> The 7300 as with most of the SDR radios lacks decent bandpass filters 
>>> on the front end, making them a bit flaky here in Europe.  For 
>>> instance when on 20m, the filter only has 10 dB rejection of signals on
> the 40m band.  Same
>>> goes for the strong broadcast stations on the 41 and 49m bands.   A
>>> preselector will be a must on a large multi-band antenna.
>>> 
>>> But as I said, not much choice these days.
>>> 
>>> 73
>>> Rick, DJ0IP
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: TenTec [mailto:tentec-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of 
>>> Darrell Bellerive
>>> Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 5:33 PM
>>> To: tentec at contesting.com
>>> Cc: rick at dj0ip.de
>>> Subject: Re: [TenTec] notch filter for Eagle?
>>> 
>>>   From page 43 of the Icom IC-7300 manual 
>>> (http://www.icomamerica.com/en/downloads/DownloadDocument.aspx?Docume
>>> n
>>> t=787)
>>> :
>>> 
>>> "The IC-7300 has Auto Notch and Manual Notch functions.
>>> Auto Notch:     Used in the SSB, AM and FM modes.
>>> Manual Notch:     Used in the SSB, CW, RTTY and AM modes."
>>> 
>>> How's things out in right field, Rick? :-)
>>> 
>>> 73, Darrell VE7IU
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 17-07-20 05:08 AM, rick at dj0ip.de wrote:
>>>> 7300? 7600?  > > Icom is selling the older radios at dumping prices 
>>>> because
>>> everybody > wants the new stuff (without manual notch filter). > > I 
>>> guess I should have said "every radio designed within the past 5 > 
>>> years".... > > However it is indeed possible to have the auto-notch 
>>> work within the > AGC loop. My little SKY-SDR QRP transceiver does 
>>> and its notch depth > is over
>>> 90 dB. It can even notch out two-tone interference by that > amount, 
>>> leaving the SSB signal on channel, free and in the clear. > > And it 
>>> does not turn on during CW because it would notch every dit > and dah 
>>> completely out. > >
>>> 73 Rick > > -----Original
>>> Message----- From: TenTec > [mailto:tentec-bounces at contesting.com] On 
>>> Behalf Of Greg S via > TenTec Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 2:00 PM To:
>>> Discussion of > Ten-Tec Equipment Cc: Greg S Subject: Re: [TenTec] 
>>> notch filter for > Eagle? > > Every ICOM HF rig has a manual and auto
> notch.
>>> Unfortunately most are > an either/or proposition. Greg, KC8HXO >
>>> -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 7/20/17, > 
>>> rick at dj0ip.de <Rick at DJ0IP.de> wrote: > > Subject: Re: [TenTec] notch 
>>> filter for Eagle? To: "'Discussion of > Ten-Tec Equipment'"
>>> <tentec at contesting.com> Date: Thursday, July 20, > 2017, 3:30 AM > > 
>>> You guys are all out in right field. > > No radio's auto notch filter 
>>> works in CW mode. They cannot > distinguish between the useful tone 
>>> and the disturbing tone. > > And yes, in that case, a manual notch 
>>> filter is indeed better, but > show me a radio built today that has 
>>> one. > > I find the Eagle's notch filter effective on SSB. > > 73 
>>> Rick, DJ0IP > -- Darrell Bellerive VE7IU
>>> 
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>> --
>> Darrell Bellerive
>> VE7IU
>> 
>> 
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> --
> Darrell Bellerive
> VE7IU
> 
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