Topband: [Bulk] Re: Am I the only one in step?

Mon Feb 29 13:17:30 EST 2016

I was a participant in this years CQ-160-SSB.  Maybe some data helps the 
discussion.

I was a bit surprised to hear others using frequencies below 1820 as a 
run freq.  My recollection from very limited prior participation is that 
it was a bit unusual.  For all the reasons cited, the band is 
exceptionally crowded to about 1960KHz on Friday.  My most productive 
run frequency was 1948.  Even though my vertical antenna arrangement 
will tune most of the band, I struggle above 1960 and did gingerly 
squeeze a Q out at 1971.  So on Friday, almost all of the band was in 
use for SSB.  Directive arrays are difficult (practically impossible?) 
to build to get full band coverage.

I did feel a bit guilty working the run guys in the 1810 to 1820 
segment, but rationalized that they were there calling CQ whether I 
called or not.  (a weak mea culpa I admit and plead the jury to consider 
"contest fever").

Here are some stats from my 9 hours and 199 Q's (I'm a suffering 7 at 
47.5 deg N on the left coast and this is a terrible contest for us).

Q's below 1820 = 8 or 4%, lowest freq worked 1810
Q's between 1820 and 1840 = 19 or 9.5%

The band between 1900 and 1925 is heavily guarded by SSB and AM 
ragchewers and regular nets, go there in a contest and get QRM'd and 
hassled. So that is a fact of life.  Then there are some strange 
"tweets" I hear around 1840 that make about 10KHz very difficult to use 
for SSB.  I did work a few Caribbean/SA DX, there was no particular 
pattern as to where.

Regarding DXpeditions, many are planned to coincide with major contests 
in order to maximize the Q opportunity.  Big splits are often used on 
40m SSB, e.g. 7120/7190 and nothing prevents a CW 160m DXpedition from 
1802/1990, just saying the antenna bandwidth argument cuts both ways.  
There were several cw guys at it at 1900 in this contest.

I'm always reluctant to ask for more regulations - be careful what you 
ask for, you might get it!  Then how does one draw the line? - RTTY, 
infinite digital modes, digital voice, etc etc all will want their 
slice.  And then there is the FCC random result, consider the change 
that messed up 80m RTTY.

The contest organizers are IMO the best way to affect change.  Their 
scoring programs can toss all Q's sufficiently "out of band plan" and 
I'd be happy if that was 1820 and lower.  Ultimately, that will 
encourage building of antennas that cover more of the band.  Also recall 
that above 1900 was useless for many years, so there is history to 
consider as well as what other entities allow for amateur radio.

73,
Grant  KZ1W
Redmond, WA

On 2/29/2016 8:01 AM, Roger Parsons via Topband wrote:
> Thank you for your comments Tom.
>
>
> The NA band plan has phone at above 1840kHz. My proposal is for phone above 1817kHz (and perhaps below 1810kHz) which seems to me to accept that this is not normal band loading.
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> Please see my previous post regarding antenna bandwidth.
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> I don't know where you get your 'two weekends a year'. I did a quick skim and found the following significant phone contests which include 160m:
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> CQ160, ARRL DX, Russian DX, WPX, ARRL FD, IARU, CQWW.
>
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> Obviously the effects will vary between contests and between different areas of the world. There are also many QSO parties and a great number of smaller contests.
>
> CW contests do not preclude phone operation on top band - they just move it further up the band. SSB contests at present leave no space whatsoever for any other modes.
>
>
> Your wonderings leave me bemused. Your question can just as easily be reversed: "Why would somebody plan a 160m phone contest when there is a DXpedition planned?" and make just as much sense. I believe that one of the current DXpeditions is actually a spare time operation of people who are working in the country for a short period. Difficult to change that timing. And why on earth should they be prevented from operating on 160m if that is their pleasure, any more than you should be prevented from operating in a 160m phone contest when that is your pleasure.
>
> But the most important fact is that it is entirely possible for CW and phone to coexist during a 160m phone contest. Leave a very small bandwidth (enough for 3 SSB stations) where phone contest operators are not permitted. Write it into the contest rules so that regulations and bandplans become irrelevant.
>
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> Again I ask. Why not?
>
> 73 Roger
> VE3ZI
>
> ________________________________
> From: Tom Haavisto <kamham69 at gmail.com>
> To: Roger Parsons <ve3zi at yahoo.com>
> Cc: TopBand List <topband at contesting.com>; Contest <cq-contest at contesting.com>
> Sent: Sunday, 28 February 2016, 19:19
> Subject: Re: Topband: Am I the only one in step?
>
>
>
> I think there is a few things that need to also be taken into account.
>
> A bandplan is designed for *normal* band loading.  Clearly, when there is a contest on, we are NOT dealing with normal band loading.
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> As has been noted, antenna bandwidth is part of the issue.
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> Phone contests will take up two weekends out of the year on Topband.
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> What happens when there is a CW contest?  We move up the band to accomodate the extra activity...  With a phone contest, with folks using <1Khz spacing, every little of extra space helps.  So yes - folks DO move down into the CW part of the band.
>
> But - I cannot help but wonder - why would someone plan a DXpedition (much planning involved), and NOT take a 160 phone contest into consideration?  I have seen some DXpeditions go to the WARC bands if there is a major contest on when they are on.  Or - they operate the other mode (operate CW when there is a phone contest on, and vice versa).  Could a DXpedition not stay off 160 for the weekend they are there (assuming they are not there FOR the contest), and focus on 80 meters instead?  Not EVERY serious DXer is on 160, and I am sure more than a few of them would appreciate the extra attention (a weekends worth) to their favorite band/mode/whatever as the DXpedition does not operate on Topband.
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> Just "seems odd" to me.
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> Tom - VE3CX
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> On Sun, Feb 28, 2016 at 10:22 AM, Roger Parsons via Topband <topband at contesting.com> wrote:
>
> I enjoy contests but...
>>
>> This weekend has seen the CQ 160m SSB Contest. It has also seen CW activity or attempted activity from a number of extremely rare DX entities.
>>
>> Why is it reasonable or even acceptable for the band to be full of SSB contesters from 1800kHz to about 1960kHz? The vast majority of contacts made in the contest are same continent, and in the case of NA could and should all comply with the band plan. Why is the CW part of the band full of SSB whereas the top (phone) end of the band is almost empty?
>>
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>> I have previously suggested to the contest administrators at both CQ and ARRL that they set in the contest rules a lower operational limit of 1820kHz dial frequency. That would give contesters 23kHz of the 'prime' international frequencies between 1810kHz and 1840kHz, and a total 183kHz for many countries. The CW DX operators would have 7kHz internationally. Neither CQ nor ARRL have treated this suggestion seriously, nor come up with any alternative.
>>
>> Why not?
>>
>> 73 Roger
>> VE3ZI
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