[TowerTalk] TowerTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 41

Sun Aug 14 23:04:51 EDT 2005

Oh I have some pics of mine if you want them.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <towertalk-request at contesting.com>
To: <towertalk at contesting.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2005 9:06 PM
Subject: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 41

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>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. 6m STACK AND HF ANTENNA (N4BAA - JOSE CASTILLO)
>   2. 6m STACK AND HF ANTENNA (N4BAA - JOSE CASTILLO)
>   3. Who makes the best mobile amp? (Jack)
>   4. 160 inverte L (Tom Osborne)
>   5. Re: 160 inverte L (SavageBR at aol.com)
>   6. Re: 160 inverte L (Tom Osborne)
>   7. FS list update (Mark Brown)
>   8. Worm gear winch used on crank up tower (Carl)
>   9. Re: 160 inverte L (Tom Rauch)
>  10. Re: 160 inverte L (Tom Osborne)
>  11. Re: 160 inverte L (K4SAV)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 12:42:56 -0400
> From: N4BAA - JOSE CASTILLO <n4baa at cox.net>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] 6m STACK AND HF ANTENNA
> To: towertalk at contesting.com
> Message-ID: <42FF7490.8050409 at cox.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Good Day All,
>
> Am having to move again...and have a question.
>
> I want to stack my FORCE 12 4BA (10-12-15-17 meter) antenna
> in between two 6 meter yagis that are stacked 16 feet apart.
>
> Is 8 feet seperation going to be adequate between the HF
> antenna (10m third harmonic is 64Mhz) and the 6M ones?
>
> I currently have a 7 ele 6 meter antenna 5 feet above my 5
> ele 20M mono (42 ft boom) and 5 feet below the FORCE 12 4BA
> with ZERO interaction..Antennas on that tower work graet.
>
> If you have any experience with anything that closely
> resembles this, I would be very thankful.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Jose Castillo - N4BAA
> Va Bch, VA
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 12:42:32 -0400
> From: N4BAA - JOSE CASTILLO <n4baa at cox.net>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] 6m STACK AND HF ANTENNA
> To: towertalk at contesting.com
> Message-ID: <42FF7478.9030005 at cox.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Good Day All,
>
> Am having to move again...and have a question.
>
> I want to stack my FORCE 12 4BA (10-12-15-17 meter) antenna
> in between two 6 meter yagis that are stacked 16 feet apart.
>
> Is 8 feet seperation going to be adequate between the HF
> antenna (10m third harmonic is 64Mhz) and the 6M ones?
>
> I currently have a 7 ele 6 meter antenna 5 feet above my 5
> ele 20M mono (42 ft boom) and the FORCE 12 4BA with ZERO
> interaction..Antennas on that tower work graet.
>
> If you have any experience with anything that closely
> resembles this, I would be very thankful.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Jose Castillo - N4BAA
> Va Bch, VA
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 15:11:02 -0400
> From: Jack <videorov at direcway.com>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] Who makes the best mobile amp?
> To: towertalk at contesting.com
> Message-ID: <008101c5a103$ed8cf920$0100a8c0 at internet>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> Looking for one for my motorhome and Kenwood B-2000
>
> Jack
> KZ4USA
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:37:24 -0700
> From: "Tom Osborne" <w7why at verizon.net>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] 160 inverte L
> To: "Towertalk" <towertalk at contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <000f01c5a118$5ce20310$1f12fea9 at Tom>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=original
>
>    Hi all
>
> I just put up a 160 meter inverted L and the antenna is resonant after
> tweaking about 1850.  It shows a resonant SWR of almost 3 to 1, but on the
> MFJ 259, is shows a resistance of around 40 ohms at the resonant point.  I
> have about 70 feet vertical and the rest horizontal.   The only thing is
> that up in the tree, it is about 6 feet from the 80 meter inverted V.
> Would that make it so bad?
>
> This antenna has LOTS of radials.  I also have 3 40 meter verticals, and I
> tied the 3 of the radials from the 160 inverted L to the hub each of the 40
> meter radials, so there is probably 3/4 mile or more of radials.
>
> I know that it is not good to have a perfect 1:1 SWR on a vertical if it is
> playing right.  With the 40 ohms of resistance, it seems as though it should
> be 1:5:1 or so.  I could live with that---but 3:1?   What's happening.  73
>
> Tom W7WHY
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 17:45:21 EDT
> From: SavageBR at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] 160 inverte L
> To: w7why at verizon.net, towertalk at contesting.com
> Message-ID: <1de.41af2bdf.30311571 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> What do you mean by "resonant". Does the MFJ 259 show zero reactance at the
> "resonant frequency" where you are reading 40 ohms resistive?
>
> Bruce
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 15:33:59 -0700
> From: "Tom Osborne" <w7why at verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] 160 inverte L
> To: "Towertalk" <towertalk at contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <000601c5a120$446062c0$1f12fea9 at Tom>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=original
>
> Hi Bruce
>
> This is the model 259, not the 259B. It has 2 meters, 1 is "SWR" and the
> other is "resistance.".
>
>
>> What do you mean by "resonant". Does the MFJ 259 show zero reactance at
>> the
>> "resonant frequency" where you are reading 40 ohms resistive?
>>
>> Bruce
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
>> Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with
>> any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TowerTalk mailing list
>> TowerTalk at contesting.com
>> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 18:30:48 -0500
> From: Mark Brown <kb0pyo at direcway.com>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] FS list update
> To: nlrs at mailman.qth.net, vhf at w6yx.stanford.edu,
> towertalk at contesting.com
> Message-ID: <CMEALJLHBNEDAMCEHEEIOEJICEAA.kb0pyo at direcway.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> More for sale, I am in SW MN and towers and antennas will be pick up only.
>
> SOLD  Yaesu FT897 w/dsp $650
>
> 3 wideband rf amp modules cover 5 to 90 mhz at 350 watts each (duty cycle
> unknown, I think they were MRI driver amps), 2 are working, one is spare
> parts, rack mount case and 48 volt 25 amp switchmode supply $400/offer
>
> SOLD  ARR 2m preamp sp144vdg $40
>
> SOLD  Tohotsu cx-520d relay, new $90
>
> Tohotsu cx-120a relay, new $40
>
> box of 15 1/2 inch hardline connectors 10 ldf and 5 superflex $100 or offer
> (some
> used some new)
>
> 2 1 5/8th's" hardline connectors, used, make offer
>
>
>
> M^2 1296 2 port power divider $50
>
> Tower packages, will need to be taken down:
>
> 30 foot rohn 25 with tilt base, M^2 2m5wl antenna, ham IV rotor and control
> box and about 50 feet 1/2 inch hardline and rotor cable $600/offer for the
> package, tower is house bracketed and will have to be dismantled for
> removal.
>
> Wilson TT-45b tower with RB-45b rotating base and raising fixture (lets
> tower freestand and the whole tower rotates), 2 M^2 5m5 antennas with 2 port
> power divider harness, Ham IV rotor (directional pot is bad) and 15 foot
> mast, and approx 120 feet of 7/8ths inch hardline and rotor cable.
> $1000/offer for the package, tower has tilt base assembly but the antennas
> and mast would need to be removed first.
>
> Spare antennas:
>
> 2 m^2 2m5wls $130 each
>
> M^2 432 13wl $125
>
> M^2 2m HO loop, new $50
>
>
> I also have a Delhi (same as the rohn bx64) 64 foot tower with rotor plates
> and thrust bearings, tower is down and ready to go $250
>
> pile of short hardline runs (50-60 feet, 1/2" and 7/8ths") not sure what all
> is in there $100
>
> Tubes:
>
> GS23b/4cx1600u tetrode $200
>
> GS35b triode $125
>
> Amperex 8165 date code 64-09, new, same as a 3-400z $125
>
> Power supplies:
>
> Astron RS50m $150
>
> Pyramid ps50 $100
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.8/71 - Release Date: 8/12/2005
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:16:17 -0400
> From: "Carl" <cfwb at cox.net>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] Worm gear winch used on crank up tower
> To: "TowerTalk Reflector" <towertalk at contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <007501c5a136$f23dced0$1802a8c0 at carl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
>
> Anyone using a worm gear winch powered by their cordless drill to raise their
> crank-up tower ?  I have a 2 section Hy-Gain tower (HG-37SS) and wondering
> about the feasibility of replacing my brake winch with the worm gear winch.
> It sure would make it nice to be able to use the cordless drill to raise and lower
> it !  Any thoughts ?
>
> Thanks & 73,
> Carl  K8AV
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> LUCK: When preparation meets opportunity !
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:41:29 -0400
> From: "Tom Rauch" <w8ji at contesting.com>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] 160 inverte L
> To: "Tom Osborne" <w7why at verizon.net>, "Towertalk"
> <towertalk at contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <003d01c5a13a$750ba640$6401a8c0 at akorn.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>> This is the model 259, not the 259B. It has 2 meters, 1 is
> "SWR" and the
>> other is "resistance.".
>>
>
> Tom,
>
> First... I disagree with the wording on that meter. That
> meter is labeled resistance, but it is really only
> resistance under certain specific conditions. Outside of
> those very specific conditions, where SWR meter reading is
> moderately low and you tune to the point where SWR reading
> crosses a very clear minimum, that meter isn't telling you
> resistance at all! You may not have 40 ohms of anything,
> unless it is at a clear SWR minimum point.
>
> The 259B cured that problem.
>
> Second...we often hear people say a complex impedance of
> nearly 50 ohms containing some X and some R will produce a
> low SWR. That's wrong too.
>
> The only way SWR would read near 1:1 is if reactance is
> nearly zero.
>
> 73 Tom
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 18:56:07 -0700
> From: "Tom Osborne" <w7why at verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] 160 inverte L
> To: "Towertalk" <towertalk at contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <000601c5a13c$8137e1c0$1f12fea9 at Tom>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=original
>
> Hi Tom
>
> The resistance reading of 40 ohms was at the low point of the SWR reading.
> There is a definate dip in the SWR, but it is up almost at 3:1.
>
> Tom W7WHY
>
>
>
>
>> Tom,
>>
>> First... I disagree with the wording on that meter. That
>> meter is labeled resistance, but it is really only
>> resistance under certain specific conditions. Outside of
>> those very specific conditions, where SWR meter reading is
>> moderately low and you tune to the point where SWR reading
>> crosses a very clear minimum, that meter isn't telling you
>> resistance at all! You may not have 40 ohms of anything,
>> unless it is at a clear SWR minimum point.
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:58:27 -0500
> From: K4SAV <RadioIR at charter.net>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] 160 inverte L
> To: towertalk at contesting.com
> Message-ID: <42FFF6C3.4050604 at charter.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> The MFJ259 doesn't give you the resistive part of the impedance when the
> SWR is not equal to 1:1.  From the tests I have done with it , I think
> it is giving you the total impedance.  In the mnual, they imply that at
> minimum SWR reading, you can read the resistance, but this is not true,
> if that SWR is far away from 1:1.
>
> As you measured, you can have a 3:1 SWR and read 40 ohms on the meter.
> This says that the equivalent impedance of the circuit being measured is
> 40 ohms.  It doesn't tell you anything about the actual resistance or
> reactance of the load. The SWR is defined in term of reflection
> coefficients, not in terms of resistance ratios, or in terms of
> equivalent impedance ratios.  In your case, you have a circuit with high
> reflection coefficients (caused by high reactance).
>
> Also when the meter reads minimum SWR, this is not necessarily the exact
> resonant point.  Minimum SWR doesn't always coincide with zero
> reactance.  It is usually close but not exact.
>
> When I was using the MFJ259 and needed to know the actual R+jX,  I used
> to take a variable cap or a variable inductor and put in in series with
> the load being measured, set the MFJ to the frequency I wanted, tune the
> cap or inductor for minimum R.  This will tune out the reactance of the
> load and let you measure the actual resistive part at this frequency.
> To get the reactive part, I would measure the cap/inductor on a bridge
> and calculate the reactance of the load.  A lot more trouble than using
> the MFJ259B, but if it's all you got...
>
>
> Jerry, K4SAV
>
>
> Tom Osborne wrote:
>
>>    Hi all
>>
>>I just put up a 160 meter inverted L and the antenna is resonant after
>>tweaking about 1850.  It shows a resonant SWR of almost 3 to 1, but on the
>>MFJ 259, is shows a resistance of around 40 ohms at the resonant point.  I
>>have about 70 feet vertical and the rest horizontal.   The only thing is
>>that up in the tree, it is about 6 feet from the 80 meter inverted V.
>>Would that make it so bad?
>>
>>This antenna has LOTS of radials.  I also have 3 40 meter verticals, and I
>>tied the 3 of the radials from the 160 inverted L to the hub each of the 40
>>meter radials, so there is probably 3/4 mile or more of radials.
>>
>>I know that it is not good to have a perfect 1:1 SWR on a vertical if it is
>>playing right.  With the 40 ohms of resistance, it seems as though it should
>>be 1:5:1 or so.  I could live with that---but 3:1?   What's happening.  73
>>
>>Tom W7WHY
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>
>>See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless Weather 
>>Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with any questions and ask 
>>for Sherman, W2FLA.
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>TowerTalk mailing list
>>TowerTalk at contesting.com
>>http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> TowerTalk mailing list
> TowerTalk at contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>
>
> End of TowerTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 41
> *****************************************
> 