[TowerTalk] Wiring and the code was (RE: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 25, Issue 139)

Tue Jan 25 14:30:20 EST 2005

It may depend on where you live, but in this area of Michigan you do not 
have a choice.  Well, you could ignore the codes and not get a building 
permit, but there are some stiff fines if caught with the possibility of 
being required to remove the wiring even if it does meet code.

The code applies through both the NEC and our local zoning to *all* 
buildings, not just the primary dwelling.

Roger Halstead (K8RI, EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
N833R, World's Oldest Debonair (S# CD-2)
www.rogerhalstead.com

> Gary,
>
> For a household where humans live you cannot get away from NEC wiring 
> unless
> you build the house yourself with cash and no building permit.  IOW, 
> forget
> it!
>
> For a barn you can wire any way you see fit.  I designed my barn wiring on
> actual current measurements, not NEC specs.  The 50A breaker is not really
> needed on the lighting circuit.  It is what I had for the mains box at the
> time.  The mains breaker box is no longer manufactured and a new 30A 
> breaker
> costs about $50.  In the barn there is another breaker box with breakers 
> to
> match romex size (14ga-15A, 12ga-20A).  This box feeds all lighting/outlet
> circuits.  Unless there is a total load of 50A continuous on this 
> secondary
> box (highly unlikely), the 10ga wire is not going to heat up and burn down
> the barn.
>
> Keith NM5G
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com
> [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Gary Schafer
> Sent: Monday, January 24, 2005 10:11 PM
> To: keith at dutson.net
> Cc: towertalk at contesting.com
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] RE: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 25, Issue 139
>
> I don't follow your logic here. The #10 wire that he had is ok for a 30 
> amp
> breaker. Which by the way (the #10 wire) is "a little more than 1/2"
> as you advocate, for the 50 amp breaker but was obvious it was not heavy
> enough for the 50 amp water heater.
>
> Also why would it be ok to use smaller wire in a barn with too large a
> breaker on it? Barns do burn too.
>
> 73
> Gary  K4FMX
>
>
>
> Keith Dutson wrote:
>> This is not a house, no humans live in the barn.  The electric water
>> heater is a pulse unit, only about 30 percent average power drawn from
> mains.
>>
>> Keith NM5G
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com
>> [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Gary Schafer
>> Sent: Monday, January 24, 2005 8:49 PM
>> To: keith at dutson.net
>> Cc: towertalk at contesting.com
>> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] RE: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 25, Issue 139
>>
>> Why do you think the wire rating should be any different than in the
> house?
>> Wire size should be rated for the full amount of the breaker. A 15 amp
>> breaker will not trip at 15 amps immediately. It takes several minutes.
>> Some it takes almost twice that to ever trip them.
>> An electric water heater is a pretty constant load.
>>
>> 73
>> Gary  K4FMX
>>
>>
>> Keith Dutson wrote:
>>
>>>Barn wiring is pretty simple.  Your wire needs to be rated at a bit
>>>above half the breaker amperage to handle the anticipated constant
>>>amperage.  Max current only happens when lights are first turned on
>>>and
>>
>> motors/fans start.
>>
>>>It's not like a house where you would be running several appliances at
>>>one time.
>>>
>>>Keith NM5G
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com
>>>[mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Mike Maddox
>>>Sent: Monday, January 24, 2005 3:34 PM
>>>To: towertalk at contesting.com
>>>Subject: [TowerTalk] RE: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 25, Issue 139
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>A funny story along this line...
>>>
>>>I was looking out the window toward the barn one night and saw all
>>>lights going from bright to dim for a second or two, then back to
>>>bright,
>>
>> etc.
>>
>>>They were so dim it is almost as if someone was flicking the light 
>>>switch.
>>>My XYL had just finished riding horses with some friends, and they
>>>were taking saddles off and putting the horses back in the stalls.
>>>
>>>Later while we were having supper I remarked about the lights.  She
>>>said it was the water heater.  Seems she installed one of those
>>>"instant" water heaters.  The next day I went out to see the heater.
>>>It
>>
>> is 230/240V, 50A.
>>
>>>The mains to the barn is ONE 50A circuit on 10 gauge romex!
>>>
>>>No, my XYL is not a ham.  I'll let you guess the color of her hair.
>>><grin>
>>>
>>>The heater now has its own 50A circuit.
>>>
>>>Keith NM5G
>>>
>>>
>>>Hope you are now using 6 gauge wire for a 50 amp circuit.  10 is rated
>>>for 30 amps.  There are a lot of those kind of set ups around.  Maybe
>>>it's the horse<sense>!  I've got a horse fanatic nearby that only has
>>>a 60 amp service to her house (a total electric house) and 60 amps
>>>going
>>
>> to her barn.
>>
>>>Can't understand why parts of her walls get hot, and electric
>>>appliances don't seem to last very long.  Gave up trying to explain it
>>>to
>>
>> her.
>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>
>>>See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers",
>>>"Wireless Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free,
>>>1-800-333-9041 with any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>TowerTalk mailing list
>>>TowerTalk at contesting.com
>>>http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>
>>>See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers",
>>>"Wireless
>>
>> Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041
>> with any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>TowerTalk mailing list
>>>TowerTalk at contesting.com
>>>http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers",
>> "Wireless Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free,
>> 1-800-333-9041 with any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TowerTalk mailing list
>> TowerTalk at contesting.com
>> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
> Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with 
> any
> questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TowerTalk mailing list
>> TowerTalk at contesting.com
>> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>>
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
> Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with 
> any
> questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TowerTalk mailing list
> TowerTalk at contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> See: http://www.mscomputer.com  for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless 
> Weather Stations", and lot's more.  Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with 
> any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TowerTalk mailing list
> TowerTalk at contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
> 