[TowerTalk] Phasing Verticals; Vol 98, Issue 35

Warrenwolff warrenwolff at aol.com
Sat Feb 12 10:54:36 PST 2011


You will have fun with this, BUT be very careful.  Back in the AM
days, we did this from NM, to reduce CA QRM.  Blew the coax on the 
first transmission.  SWR/matching requires attention.

Warren; W7WY





Hi Guys,

 

I've got a ground mounted 1/4 wave 40-meter vertical located at the  edge 

of a saltwater river.  Before sunset tonight, I want to add a 1/4 wave  

reflector behind it to add a little more gain towards Europe.  (a fun  little 

experiment)  I'm only looking for one direction with this antenna:  towards 

Europe... so I'll be end firing it NE with the reflector to the SW  of the 

driven element.

 

A couple quick questions:

 

1) Should I locate the reflector 1/4 wave (33') behind the driven element  

or is there a better distance to use for a simple and quick setup?

 

2) I'm looking for the simplest method of feeding these antennas as I have  

limited parts at this temporary location: a T-connector and  coax!  Would 

the use of a UHF T-Connector and  then individual feedlines to each of the 2 

verticals be the quickest  way to connect them?  If so, any recommendations 

for feedline  lengths?  

 

Thanks!

 

Dick- K9OM/4   





------------------------------



Message: 2

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 11:36:54 -0500

From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on  PL259 et al

To: "'Michael W5NIG'" <tower at coffeepower.net>,

	<towertalk at contesting.com>

Message-ID: <000001cbcad3$0f681260$2e383720$@net>



Here are two photos of what I mean by crimp-on PL-259s failing.



http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

on=view&current=Crimp-fail-1.jpg

http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

on=view&current=Crimp-fail-3.jpg



You can see the braid/ferrule has pulled back from the main part of the

connector. When installed this was flush against the body of the connector.

Eventually this will pull right off. If I hadn't soldered the center

conductor in (some are intended to just crimp on) the coax would pull right

out of the connector. When, in the middle of CQWW 2009, my 160 TX antenna

had failed I went outside and found the coax laying on the sodden ground

having failed exactly in that manner.



After the contest was over I pulled somewhat-gently on every coax sticking

down from the Ameritron antenna switchbox and two more pulled apart. At that

point I still trusted the connectors, but I insisted on soldering the

centers after that. When more failed inside the shack, on patch cables, etc,

I gave up and went back to solder-only.





------



 - pjd





-----Original Message-----

From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com

[mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Michael W5NIG

Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 9:17 AM

To: towertalk at contesting.com

Subject: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259 et al



***Quote***

Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:39:52 -0500

From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259

To: <nf4l at nf4l.com>, "'towertalk reflector'"

<towertalk at contesting.com>

Message-ID: <018401cbca3c$99d3e380$cd7baa80$@net>



Mike, I have to say my experiences with crimp-on connectors has ranged from

convenient to catastrophic failure, with the latter being commonplace. I'd

say about 75% of the crimp connectors have failed within the three years

they've been installed, both inside and outside. Once any stress goes on the

cable (just gravity for the most part), it's just been a matter of time

before it fails in my experience. I'm using connectors from The RF

Connection as well as the crimp tool they provided and I use a cable-prep

tool from DX Engineering. This summer all my remaining crimp-on connectors

will be cut off and new solder-type (inside) and clamp-type connectors

(outside) will go on instead. I'm quite intrigued about this new clamp type

and I'd personally like to get more first-hand experiences before

shotgunning out all the existing connectors.



***UnQuote***



Very interesting!   I've been using a coax prep tool for quite a while now,

it's a

love/hate relationship, hi hi.  works well though, all in all.  I just

bought a crimp

tool with the extra set of jaws at the last hamfest that I attended.  I

haven't had

opportunity yet to us one on regular rg8 or 213 but have had the pleasure of



installing

a few on 8x. I've got to say Im impressed with it in that capacity!  good

compression

on the shield and great tension on the jacket.  Usually the thing is subject



to twisting

etc and if the coax is moving a lot I eventually might have issues with it.

I"ll be testing

it on 8/213 coax at easy to get to places to see how it goes when I get back



on my tower

project!



    Michael  de W5NIG





_______________________________________________







_______________________________________________

TowerTalk mailing list

TowerTalk at contesting.com

http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk









------------------------------



Message: 3

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 11:51:37 -0500

From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

Subject: [TowerTalk] Ultra-flexible RG-213/equivalent

To: <towertalk at contesting.com>

Message-ID: <000101cbcad5$1df680d0$59e38270$@net>



Hi all,

I'd like to build my internal patch cables out of an extremely flexible

RG-213-sized coax that's rated for legal-limit power (with lots of

headroom). Any recommendations? As much as I'd like my installation to be

permanent, the reality is that I usually have to move stuff out of the

stack, move the amp to access the back of the radio stack, etc, and stiff

coax is one more hassle I'd rather not have to worry about.



-----------------------------------



Regards,



Peter,

W2IRT











------------------------------



Message: 4

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 11:55:54 -0500

From: "Gene Fuller" <w2lu at rochester.rr.com>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Adding reflector to 40-meter vertical

To: <RLVZ at aol.com>,	<towertalk at contesting.com>

Message-ID: <7E639C333FA945CBBEF73A5683ECAABA at FamilyRoom>

Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";

	reply-type=original



Hi Dick -



If "easy"is important, it might be easier to just put up a parasitiec 

reflector.  Resonate at 6.7-6.8 MHZ  and place about 25 feet behind your 

present vertical.  It will affect your SWR but if your Xmtr will tune ok and 

your feed line isn't too long ( lossy) you should be good to go. Without a 

lot of fuss your gain and f/b should be about the same as driven two 

element.



Gene / W2LU





----- Original Message ----- 

From: <RLVZ at aol.com>

To: <towertalk at contesting.com>

Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 11:25 AM

Subject: [TowerTalk] Adding reflector to 40-meter vertical





> Hi Guys,

>

> I've got a ground mounted 1/4 wave 40-meter vertical located at the  edge

> of a saltwater river.  Before sunset tonight, I want to add a 1/4 wave

> reflector behind it to add a little more gain towards Europe.  (a fun 

> little

> experiment)  I'm only looking for one direction with this antenna: 

> towards

> Europe... so I'll be end firing it NE with the reflector to the SW  of the

> driven element.

>

> A couple quick questions:

>

> 1) Should I locate the reflector 1/4 wave (33') behind the driven element

> or is there a better distance to use for a simple and quick setup?

>

> 2) I'm looking for the simplest method of feeding these antennas as I have

> limited parts at this temporary location: a T-connector and  coax!  Would

> the use of a UHF T-Connector and  then individual feedlines to each of the 

> 2

> verticals be the quickest  way to connect them?  If so, any 

> recommendations

> for feedline  lengths?

>

> Thanks!

>

> Dick- K9OM/4

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk 







------------------------------



Message: 5

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 09:10:07 -0800

From: "Jim W7RY" <w7ry at inbox.com>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on  PL259 et al

To: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>,	"'Michael W5NIG'"

	<tower at coffeepower.net>, <towertalk at contesting.com>

Message-ID: <C4665E4630EE4A15BD3FDD5DC6BA0AF7 at Laptop>

Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";

	reply-type=original



I see a connector covered with heatshrink and no shield pulling away.  ????



Jim W7RY





--------------------------------------------------

From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 8:36 AM

To: "'Michael W5NIG'" <tower at coffeepower.net>; <towertalk at contesting.com>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on  PL259 et al



> Here are two photos of what I mean by crimp-on PL-259s failing.

>

> http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

> on=view&current=Crimp-fail-1.jpg

> http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

> on=view&current=Crimp-fail-3.jpg

>

> You can see the braid/ferrule has pulled back from the main part of the

> connector. When installed this was flush against the body of the 

> connector.

> Eventually this will pull right off. If I hadn't soldered the center

> conductor in (some are intended to just crimp on) the coax would pull 

> right

> out of the connector. When, in the middle of CQWW 2009, my 160 TX antenna

> had failed I went outside and found the coax laying on the sodden ground

> having failed exactly in that manner.

>

> After the contest was over I pulled somewhat-gently on every coax sticking

> down from the Ameritron antenna switchbox and two more pulled apart. At 

> that

> point I still trusted the connectors, but I insisted on soldering the

> centers after that. When more failed inside the shack, on patch cables, 

> etc,

> I gave up and went back to solder-only.

>

>

> ------

>

> - pjd

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com

> [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Michael W5NIG

> Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 9:17 AM

> To: towertalk at contesting.com

> Subject: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259 et al

>

> ***Quote***

> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:39:52 -0500

> From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259

> To: <nf4l at nf4l.com>, "'towertalk reflector'"

> <towertalk at contesting.com>

> Message-ID: <018401cbca3c$99d3e380$cd7baa80$@net>

>

> Mike, I have to say my experiences with crimp-on connectors has ranged 

> from

> convenient to catastrophic failure, with the latter being commonplace. I'd

> say about 75% of the crimp connectors have failed within the three years

> they've been installed, both inside and outside. Once any stress goes on 

> the

> cable (just gravity for the most part), it's just been a matter of time

> before it fails in my experience. I'm using connectors from The RF

> Connection as well as the crimp tool they provided and I use a cable-prep

> tool from DX Engineering. This summer all my remaining crimp-on connectors

> will be cut off and new solder-type (inside) and clamp-type connectors

> (outside) will go on instead. I'm quite intrigued about this new clamp 

> type

> and I'd personally like to get more first-hand experiences before

> shotgunning out all the existing connectors.

>

> ***UnQuote***

>

> Very interesting!   I've been using a coax prep tool for quite a while 

> now,

> it's a

> love/hate relationship, hi hi.  works well though, all in all.  I just

> bought a crimp

> tool with the extra set of jaws at the last hamfest that I attended.  I

> haven't had

> opportunity yet to us one on regular rg8 or 213 but have had the pleasure 

> of

>

> installing

> a few on 8x. I've got to say Im impressed with it in that capacity!  good

> compression

> on the shield and great tension on the jacket.  Usually the thing is 

> subject

>

> to twisting

> etc and if the coax is moving a lot I eventually might have issues with 

> it.

> I"ll be testing

> it on 8/213 coax at easy to get to places to see how it goes when I get 

> back

>

> on my tower

> project!

>

>    Michael  de W5NIG

>

>

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk

>

>

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk

>

>

>

> -----

> No virus found in this message.

> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

> Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3439 - Release Date: 02/12/11

> 





------------------------------



Message: 6

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 12:40:42 -0500

From: K8RI on TT <k8ri-on-towertalk at tm.net>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on  PL259 et al

To: towertalk at contesting.com

Message-ID: <4D56C61A.2060604 at tm.net>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed



On 2/12/2011 11:36 AM, Peter Dougherty wrote:

> Here are two photos of what I mean by crimp-on PL-259s failing.

>

> http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

> on=view&current=Crimp-fail-1.jpg

> http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

> on=view&current=Crimp-fail-3.jpg

I've never had one pull back. It appears that possibly the wrong die was 

used not making a tight enough crimp.

The crimp sleeve is covered so I can't tell for sure, but it looks like 

the crimp may have been too far back. It should be right against the 

connector shoulder.



Photos without the heatshrink would tell much more.



73



Roger (K8RI)

> You can see the braid/ferrule has pulled back from the main part of the

> connector. When installed this was flush against the body of the connector.

> Eventually this will pull right off. If I hadn't soldered the center

> conductor in (some are intended to just crimp on) the coax would pull right

> out of the connector. When, in the middle of CQWW 2009, my 160 TX antenna

> had failed I went outside and found the coax laying on the sodden ground

> having failed exactly in that manner.

>

> After the contest was over I pulled somewhat-gently on every coax sticking

> down from the Ameritron antenna switchbox and two more pulled apart. At that

> point I still trusted the connectors, but I insisted on soldering the

> centers after that. When more failed inside the shack, on patch cables, etc,

> I gave up and went back to solder-only.

>

>

> ------

>

>   - pjd

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com

> [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Michael W5NIG

> Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 9:17 AM

> To: towertalk at contesting.com

> Subject: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259 et al

>

> ***Quote***

> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:39:52 -0500

> From: "Peter Dougherty"<w2irt at verizon.net>

> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259

> To:<nf4l at nf4l.com>, "'towertalk reflector'"

> <towertalk at contesting.com>

> Message-ID:<018401cbca3c$99d3e380$cd7baa80$@net>

>

> Mike, I have to say my experiences with crimp-on connectors has ranged from

> convenient to catastrophic failure, with the latter being commonplace. I'd

> say about 75% of the crimp connectors have failed within the three years

> they've been installed, both inside and outside. Once any stress goes on the

> cable (just gravity for the most part), it's just been a matter of time

> before it fails in my experience. I'm using connectors from The RF

> Connection as well as the crimp tool they provided and I use a cable-prep

> tool from DX Engineering. This summer all my remaining crimp-on connectors

> will be cut off and new solder-type (inside) and clamp-type connectors

> (outside) will go on instead. I'm quite intrigued about this new clamp type

> and I'd personally like to get more first-hand experiences before

> shotgunning out all the existing connectors.

>

> ***UnQuote***

>

> Very interesting!   I've been using a coax prep tool for quite a while now,

> it's a

> love/hate relationship, hi hi.  works well though, all in all.  I just

> bought a crimp

> tool with the extra set of jaws at the last hamfest that I attended.  I

> haven't had

> opportunity yet to us one on regular rg8 or 213 but have had the pleasure of

>

> installing

> a few on 8x. I've got to say Im impressed with it in that capacity!  good

> compression

> on the shield and great tension on the jacket.  Usually the thing is subject

>

> to twisting

> etc and if the coax is moving a lot I eventually might have issues with it.

> I"ll be testing

> it on 8/213 coax at easy to get to places to see how it goes when I get back

>

> on my tower

> project!

>

>      Michael  de W5NIG

>

>

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk

>

>

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk

>









------------------------------



Message: 7

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 13:11:33 -0500

From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on  PL259 et al

To: "'Jim W7RY'" <w7ry at inbox.com>, "'Michael W5NIG'"

	<tower at coffeepower.net>, 	<towertalk at contesting.com>

Message-ID: <000701cbcae0$48b6b690$da2423b0$@net>



The copper shield itself isn't visible in the shot, but it's under the

ferrule that's pulled back. That knurled portion behind the barrel of the

white heat-shrunk PL-259 (between the heat shrink and the part you rotate

onto the SO-239) should not be visible. That knurled bit should have copper

shield and crimped ferrule over top of it (and optional heat-shrink). The

"Amp Out" connector (below it) isn't in clear focus in that shot, but it's

still good. The "failed" one hasn't failed completely, the centre is still

soldered in and the electrical connections are solid (it's the lead down

from the tower). I haven't gotten around to replacing it yet but when I get

some time that's high on the priorities list, assuming there's any slack

left in the basement - it's pretty snug right now.





------



 - pjd





-----Original Message-----

From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com

[mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Jim W7RY

Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 12:10 PM

To: Peter Dougherty; 'Michael W5NIG'; towertalk at contesting.com

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259 et al



I see a connector covered with heatshrink and no shield pulling away.  ????



Jim W7RY





--------------------------------------------------

From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 8:36 AM

To: "'Michael W5NIG'" <tower at coffeepower.net>; <towertalk at contesting.com>

Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on  PL259 et al



> Here are two photos of what I mean by crimp-on PL-259s failing.

>

>

http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

> on=view&current=Crimp-fail-1.jpg

>

http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll290/W2IRT/Towers%20and%20Antennas/?acti

> on=view&current=Crimp-fail-3.jpg

>

> You can see the braid/ferrule has pulled back from the main part of the

> connector. When installed this was flush against the body of the

> connector.

> Eventually this will pull right off. If I hadn't soldered the center

> conductor in (some are intended to just crimp on) the coax would pull

> right

> out of the connector. When, in the middle of CQWW 2009, my 160 TX antenna

> had failed I went outside and found the coax laying on the sodden ground

> having failed exactly in that manner.

>

> After the contest was over I pulled somewhat-gently on every coax sticking

> down from the Ameritron antenna switchbox and two more pulled apart. At

> that

> point I still trusted the connectors, but I insisted on soldering the

> centers after that. When more failed inside the shack, on patch cables,

> etc,

> I gave up and went back to solder-only.

>

>

> ------

>

> - pjd

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com

> [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Michael W5NIG

> Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 9:17 AM

> To: towertalk at contesting.com

> Subject: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259 et al

>

> ***Quote***

> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:39:52 -0500

> From: "Peter Dougherty" <w2irt at verizon.net>

> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Crimp-on PL259

> To: <nf4l at nf4l.com>, "'towertalk reflector'"

> <towertalk at contesting.com>

> Message-ID: <018401cbca3c$99d3e380$cd7baa80$@net>

>

> Mike, I have to say my experiences with crimp-on connectors has ranged

> from

> convenient to catastrophic failure, with the latter being commonplace. I'd

> say about 75% of the crimp connectors have failed within the three years

> they've been installed, both inside and outside. Once any stress goes on

> the

> cable (just gravity for the most part), it's just been a matter of time

> before it fails in my experience. I'm using connectors from The RF

> Connection as well as the crimp tool they provided and I use a cable-prep

> tool from DX Engineering. This summer all my remaining crimp-on connectors

> will be cut off and new solder-type (inside) and clamp-type connectors

> (outside) will go on instead. I'm quite intrigued about this new clamp

> type

> and I'd personally like to get more first-hand experiences before

> shotgunning out all the existing connectors.

>

> ***UnQuote***

>

> Very interesting!   I've been using a coax prep tool for quite a while

> now,

> it's a

> love/hate relationship, hi hi.  works well though, all in all.  I just

> bought a crimp

> tool with the extra set of jaws at the last hamfest that I attended.  I

> haven't had

> opportunity yet to us one on regular rg8 or 213 but have had the pleasure

> of

>

> installing

> a few on 8x. I've got to say Im impressed with it in that capacity!  good

> compression

> on the shield and great tension on the jacket.  Usually the thing is

> subject

>

> to twisting

> etc and if the coax is moving a lot I eventually might have issues with

> it.

> I"ll be testing

> it on 8/213 coax at easy to get to places to see how it goes when I get

> back

>

> on my tower

> project!

>

>    Michael  de W5NIG

>

>

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk

>

>

> _______________________________________________

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> TowerTalk mailing list

> TowerTalk at contesting.com

> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk

>

>

>

> -----

> No virus found in this message.

> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

> Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3439 - Release Date: 02/12/11

>

_______________________________________________







_______________________________________________

TowerTalk mailing list

TowerTalk at contesting.com

http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk









------------------------------



_______________________________________________

TowerTalk mailing list

TowerTalk at contesting.com

http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk





End of TowerTalk Digest, Vol 98, Issue 35

*****************************************




 


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