[TowerTalk] low band antenna without good ground

Bob K6UJ k6uj at pacbell.net
Fri Sep 30 20:56:20 PDT 2011 

Al,

The CAT5 cable sounds good, thanks for the info.

Yes many of us hams are characterized as being cheap.  I agree with the QST columnist that chastized QST readership providing the cheap 
ham stereotype.  In my opinion they are basing their opinion on  a superficial understanding
of a typical hams spending for equipment and materials.  They need to drill down a few layers and see the overall spending profile. Take a look at a typical hams station.  He or she typically has a substantial investment in the radio gear itself,  not inexpensive stuff, hihi.   Then we look for the bargains for the peripheral equipment like coax/fittings/wire/wire, etc.  I am guilty of hauling home used coax, etc from almost every ham radio flea market I attend.  I can't resist.  :-)
Sourcing materials for a radial system is a good example of when to put on your "cheap" (or I like your term frugal)  hat.  Anything that is going in or on the ground will have a limited life span and it makes sense to minimize your investment knowing it will need to be replaced more frequently than other antenna 
wiring.  There is a swap meet coming up in a couple of weeks, I need to have my truck ready.  :-)

73,
Bob
K6UJ






On Sep 30, 2011, at 5:41 PM, Al Kozakiewicz wrote:

> Electric fence wire is usually aluminum or galvanized steel.
> 
> If you just want something to experiment with under the expectation that it need last only a few years, by all means use aluminum or galvanized or welding wire.
> 
> On the other hand, if it's a permanent installation, bite the bullet and get copper.  Even if you're running QRO, you don't need anything heavy gauge as long as you lay down enough radials.  The current will be divided among them.  Even #22 or #24 magnet wire will work if you take enough care to protect it from mechanical damage until it gets absorbed into the thatch.
> 
> One of the regular columnists in QST recently chastized the readership for stereotyping hams as cheap.  OK, except that there are a lot of cheap hams!  If you want to be "frugal", then you have to be resourceful.  Look around and you can probably find lots of CAT5 or J-K that's been ripped out of an office being remodeled.  That cable contains a useful amount of #24 copper wire that could be repurposed, although at the cost of your time.
> 
> Or go buy a 1000' box of CAT5 cable at Lowe's for about $100.  That will yield 8000 feet of #24 copper wire.
> 
> Al 
> AB2ZY
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of ROBERT HARMON
> Sent: Friday, September 30, 2011 8:20 PM
> To: towertalk at contesting.com
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] low band antenna without good ground
> 
> Sounds like the .03 dia aluminum wire probably wouldn't last very long.  I have a bunch of rolls of copper coated mig wire for steel welding that is also .03 inches dia.  Others that have tried this stuff found that it rusts very quickly, what a shame you can get 1000 foot rolls of this stuff
> pretty cheaply, sigh.................    I read from other posts is that  electric fence wire works pretty well and is not that expensive either.
> 
> Bob
> K6UJ
> 
> 
> On Sep 29, 2011, at 5:21 PM, Al Kozakiewicz wrote:
> 
>> Radiation resistance will not drop, nor would you want it to!  Ground losses will drop and so should the feedpoint impedance.
>> 
>> The lifetime of buried aluminum depends on the pH of the soil.  Usually, it isn't long.
>> 
>> Al
>> AB2ZY
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: towertalk-bounces at contesting.com 
>> [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Alex K2BB
>> Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2011 8:15 PM
>> To: Gene Smar
>> Cc: ROBERT HARMON; <towertalk at contesting.com>
>> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] low band antenna without good ground
>> 
>> I got a roll of aluminum welding wire, the one which is 0.03"...
>> The plan is to lay down 30 radials 30-35 feet long to test how much radiation resistance drops. 
>> I am just wondering- how long that wire will last if I bury it? What about thicker wire used for electric fences?
>> 
>> AM
>> 
>> On Sep 29, 2011, at 19:39, "Gene Smar" <ersmar at verizon.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> Bob:
>>> 
>>>   Instead of a copper ground clamp (likely to cause corrosion at the 
>>> connection point due to dissimilar metals in contact in water), I'd 
>>> suggest using stainless steel bolts, lockwashers and nuts plus a pair 
>>> of fender washers (above and below the screen) wherever you wish to make a connection.
>>> Fender washers are exceptionally large in diameter as compared to 
>>> normal washer sizes for the particular diameter of bolt.  They gather 
>>> a lot of metal in the connection area when applied.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 73 de
>>> Gene Smar  AD3F
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "ROBERT HARMON" <k6uj at pacbell.net>
>>> To: <towertalk at contesting.com>
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2011 6:36 PM
>>> Subject: [TowerTalk] low band antenna without good ground
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> I have been  gathering up materials for rolling out galvanized 
>>>> chicken wire for a ground screen from my vertical as discussed here 
>>>> recently.  I'm trying to figure out how to make the electrical 
>>>> connection at the base of the vertical.  Is there a nifty way to do it ?
>>>> My first thought was to take the
>>>> very end of each roll and squeeze it together into a bunch and 
>>>> attach a cooper clamp used for ground rods.
>>>> How do you make your connection ?
>>>> 
>>>> Bob
>>>> K6UJ
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> 
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