[TowerTalk] TowerTalk Digest, Vol 127, Issue 84

Wed Jul 31 20:39:40 EDT 2013

I agree Chet on the 100ft, and John on the 1.5 wl.

How high is a function of fear factor, land, budget, and "want to."

I know some hams with very deep pockets (read: they could afford whatever)
who have 100 to 120 foot towers.

The take off angle and all those algebra calculations are both good.

The other thing that is harder to calculate, is what you hear, i.e., the
received signal.

When I had a 4 L Steppir at 76 feet, I heard signals a neighbor ham would
call me and say, "I couldn't really copy them." He had a tri-bander at 60
feet.

In the old, old days, Mike Ercolino experimented on his signal range, and
determined two 3L monobanders, top one 120ft, was a only bit below much
taller towers. Mike said, "You need gold in the hills, to gain a few db
above 3 over 3."

But then there are things like this: K4SSU and I were on the air talking to
his friend in Australia. A Hawaii (5k miles) ham broke in to give us signal
reports.

I got S9 plus ten...and thought that was good, until he gave Dave, S9 plus
30. Dave was also hearing the Hawaii ham about 20 db better than I.

Dave had two six L 20m monobanders...top one was at 150, and the bottom one
was at 75. My math says, Dave had 20 db on xmit, but he also had about 20 db
more received signal than a 4L at 75,

My fear factor limits me to 104 ft and 4 over 4 (going up in September)...I
will just have to live with Dave being about 20+ db louder...no worries :-) 

And that's my 2 cents y'll.

73, Grant W5XB

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Subject: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 127, Issue 84

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: How high is enough (john at kk9a.com)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2013 11:52:37 -0400
From: john at kk9a.com
To: TowerTalk at contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] How high is enough
Message-ID: <77b6298c6b15d2d1bdd379e2d6ef86d7.squirrel at www11.qth.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1

I recall reading in W2PV's Yagi Antenna book that the best height for a
single yagi is 1.5 WL.

John KK9A

---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------
Subject: RE: [TowerTalk] How high is enough
From:    "chetmoore" <chetmoore at cox.net>
Date:    Wed, July 31, 2013 11:03 am
To:      john at kk9a.com
         TowerTalk at contesting.com

I seem to remember somewhere, possibly in the early pvrc contest college
video  tape series) where W3LPL said  for contesting, if you can only have
ONE tower, make it a 100 footer. Your beam or beams will work well and the
low band wire antennas you hang below it at 90 feet will be high enough
To work well also.   Works for me !!!

73

Chet N4FX

-----Original Message-----
From: TowerTalk [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of
john at kk9a.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 8:13 AM
To: TowerTalk at contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] How high is enough

An antenna at 50' will work. Your subject "How high is enough" suggest that
you are looking for some compromise between performance and tower height.
Only you can make that decision. Certainly you could install a 70'
tower instead of a 50' one on your small lot if you really wanted to. K9YC
suggested reading the ARRL Antenna Book. This is a great suggestion! If you
can find W2PV's (sk) yagi book there is also a lot of information there
regarding yagi radiation angle relative to height. Regarding the question is
a SteppIR 80m dipole better than a wire one, the answer is again not simple.
A true full size horizontal dipole at the same height should be more
efficient than a loaded one, however you cannot turn the wire dipole or
adjust it for the segment of the band that you are using.

John KK9A

To:	 <TowerTalk at contesting.com>
Subject:	 [TowerTalk] How high is enough
From:	 "Jim in Waco wb5oxq" <wb5oxq_1 at grandecom.net>
Date:	 Tue, 30 Jul 2013 21:46:28 -0500

When choosing a height for a beam is 1/4 wave above ground at the lowest
frequency enough?  1/2 wave?  I see Force 12 rating the gain on their beams
at 74'1".
Why that height?  At 20 meters is 100' a lot better than say 60'?  I am
talking about relatively flat terrain.  I see Stepp-ir makes a beam that
even has a 80 meter dipole in it.  Would that workmuch better on 80 than a
wire dipole at an equal height?  I have never had enough land to put upmore
than 50' bit nest year I might have over an acre and be able to go much
higher.  I just wonder how high when you spend more to go higher than it is
worth?  If I had the room for a wire dipole to run any direction, what would
be the best choice from central Texas considering being in the center of the
country east/west wise?  I want to get the best bang for my buck!  wb5oxq

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End of TowerTalk Digest, Vol 127, Issue 84
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