You are saying the gain of the shorty-forty is just 0.5db? 73 Peter -----Original Message----- From: TowerTalk [mailto:towertalk-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Tony Brock-Fisher All in all, between the coil losses and the directivity, I'd say it is ~4 db better than the shorty-forty in forward gain. That's a lot on 40m!