[TowerTalk] Fwd: Sad news N5IA SK in tower fall (Shawn Donley - N3AE)

Thu Jun 16 10:36:24 EDT 2016

I had a similar thought once: Place a pulley on the top. Put a weight, about half the weight of the climber, at one end and the climber on the other end of the wire, going through the pulley. Now, the climber has an easier time to climb as the wire pulls him up. In case he/she slips the weight will reduce the speed which he/she will fall at and possibly allow him/her to grab on to the tower.

As this will increase the weight loading the tower my second thought was to have a winch at the top of the tower and attach the wire from the winch to the climber. That will also ease the climbing and secure a slow descent regardless if the climber falls or is descending on purpose.

Can I get some input on that? Winches are available with remote control and there are several on the market that can be used this purpose but I don't know how safe they are.

Just some ideas,

Hans - N2JFS

-----Original Message-----
From: ve4xt <ve4xt at mymts.net>
To: Dick Green WC1M <wc1m73 at gmail.com>
Cc: N3AE <n3ae at comcast.net>; <towertalk at contesting.com> <towertalk at contesting.com>
Sent: Thu, Jun 16, 2016 10:05 am
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Sad news N5IA SK in tower fall (Shawn Donley - N3AE)

Hi Dick,

It would get in the way of the rotation, wouldn't it?

What if you ran the belayer's line through the middle of the tower, through pulleys at the top so in use, the line from top to climber is outside, but when not in use, you'd use it to haul a weight to the top? This way, when not in use, the climber's line is out of the way of the antennas rotating on the rings. When you needed to climb, you'd undo the line holding the weight, let gravity bring the line to ground level, attach the climber and up you go.

Thinking you'd also need a snatch block at the bottom of the tower so the line through the tower would come out horizontal to the belayer.

Ring-mounted rotators also defeat most other continuous-attachment systems, don't they?

73, kelly, ve4xt 

Sent from my iPad

> On Jun 15, 2016, at 8:25 PM, Dick Green WC1M <wc1m73 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Interesting idea, but it wouldn't work with towers that have TIC rings.
> 
> 73, Dick WC1M
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: N3AE [mailto:n3ae at comcast.net] 
> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2016 9:11 AM
> To: towertalk at contesting.com
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Sad news N5IA SK in tower fall (Shawn Donley - N3AE)
> 
> It's with some trepidation that I respond to this thread, but there''s one other climbing technique I have not seen mentioned in this forum. 
> 
> For modest height towers, say up to 75 feet, why not climb it like a top-roped rock climb? Have two (redundancy) mountaineering grade locking carabiners secured at the top of the tower with a suitable temporary rope loop (like 3/16 Dacron) going to the ground through the carabiners. On the day of the climb, use the temporary rope to pull some 9 to10mm static line (like BlueWater Assaultline) through the carabiner to the ground. 
> 
> Attach your harness to the climbing rope and have a competent and properly equipped belayer on the ground to take up the rope and protect you during the climb. "Competent" in this context means someone you trust your life to and vice versa...i.e. a fellow climber. 
> 
> Advantages: 
> 
> 1. Always on slight rope tension (provided by the belayer) so minimal fall distance and shock loads. 
> 2. No energy expenditure (or fatigue related mistakes) hooking and unhooking safety lanyards to the tower during the climb. 
> 3. Can concentrate on the climb with less distraction. 
> 
> Disadvantages: 
> 
> 1. Need to climb in a conventional safe manner once to get the carabiners installed. 
> 2. Carabiners will need replaced periodically 3. Need a competent and experienced belayer 
> 
> Some comments on rope: 
> 
> A typical "dynamic" climbing rope with zero slack (belayer has slight tension) will elongate by about 10% with a 180 lb climber on it. Example: 60 ft tower. Say you are only10 ft up the tower. So ~ 110 ft of rope between you and the belayer. If you fall, the rope will stretch about 10 ft (but like a bungee) and you WOULD land on the ground but softly. Fall near the top: ~ 60 ft of rope between you and the belayer. So you'd bungee down about 6 ft. In either case, there could be risk of injury if an arm or a leg was across a tower brace prior to or during the fall. 
> 
> A "static line" typically used for mountain rescue or rappelling into caves, has an elongation < 3% (for a 300 lb load), so in the above example, the "fall distance) would be < 3 ft and <1.5 ft. 
> 
> A "dynamic" climbing rope will be better at reducing shock loads in a fall, but I'd be concerned about possible arm or leg injury if either got across a tower brace member prior to or during the fall. That's why I'm thinking a "static" type rope and zero slack at all times (belayer responsibility). 
> 
> I've climbed towers and rock for many years. Not so much rock now that I'm older. Always felt safer on a top-roped rock climb, even compared to climbing towers with conventional "always attached" technique and gear. 
> 
> So how DO I climb towers? I use conventional methods and gear following the "always attached" philosophy only because I rarely have an experienced rock climber around to belay. Nevertheless, having been on both towers and rock, I wonder which technique would be better (safety and efficiency)? 
> 
> OK. Ready for the incoming stones and rocks. 
> 
> N3AE 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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