[UK-CONTEST] Contest UBN's

Wed Apr 18 07:30:23 PDT 2012

Yes Ray,
 It is possible to edit recordings but as a colleague of mine once said
giving evidence, when that same point was put to him at the Old Bailey. 
	His answer was that's it's possible to send people to the moon but I
don't expect my neighbour  to do it with the contents of his garden tool
shed. It's all a matter of ease.   Carry on recording.
73 Clive GM3POI  

-----Original Message-----
From: uk-contest-bounces at contesting.com
[mailto:uk-contest-bounces at contesting.com] On Behalf Of Ray James
Sent: 18 April 2012 13:29
To: uk-contest at contesting.com
Subject: [UK-CONTEST] Contest UBN's

Interesting thread.
This is an area that has come to my attention since UBN's starting being
provided in the UKAC submissions so it's not just a HF contest issue.

Nobody is infallible to making a reception mistake and therefore rightly
having the contact removed but it is plainly unfair that the sender of a
mistake gets off Scot free.
I have resorted to recording microwave events after receiving the occasional
UBN when I was 100% sure what I submitted was what I'd received from a
fellow competitor.
The value of doing this was immediate as I lost two contacts in the March
23cm UKAC!
It didn't change my table position but I was able to prove the culprits did
send what I'd received and not what they'd reported.
They lost nothing when they really should have been placed at least one or
two positions lower in the results which would effect the normalised scores
so everyone loses out except for the offender(s).
A worse case scenario would be somebody actually losing the 1,000 point top
spot and being replaced by an error maker.

I have been in communication with the adjudicator regarding this situation
and appreciate it is already a matter under discussion prior to this thread
appearing. 

I personally think it would be very unfair to take the easy option and scrub
the contact for both parties but certainly favour a change from it only
being the receiving station who gets penalised.

As has been brought to my attention, recordings can edited. Someone would
really need to be desperate to go to those lengths when it is a hobby but it
is a possibility.

As we're all enjoying the benefit of a quicker adjudicating and results
service, it's not an easy nut to crack and submitting a total recording as
Dave suggests wouldn't help that task.
The suggestion I have made is that on receipt of a UBN a strict short window
of appeal is present when evidence can be presented. 

If you miss it then tough, otherwise it could go on forever and I'm sure all
adjudicators have plenty other things to do.

Once I hit the send button I'm off to check last nights 23cm UKAC recording
and once submitted I'll post a report later.

73 Ray GM4CXM

________________________________
 From: dave <daveg3tbk at googlemail.com>

One problem with your penalty idea is that the receiving station could 

be penalised when the sending station had sent the call incorrectly.
I am thinking particularly of stations omitting to send "/P" on Field Days.

There are at least 5 such errors in my UBN, and having checked (again) 
the recording the /P was certainly not sent.
Additionally in 2 cases the station sent "/P" but apparently was not!
In all these cases the stations concerned were European, not in UK.

This problem is always worse on SSB than CW, when of course most 
stations use the PC to send the exchange.

Perhaps in future we should submit recordings along with the logs!

73 Dave
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