[VHFcontesting] What about me? I am captive.

Thu Aug 18 03:00:12 EDT 2005

HI, Tim,

I think that you are a great rover and greatly appreciate the favor you do  
for all of us in the VHF and up community with your hard work and great  
roving skills!

I think it is a tiny very vocal minority that has been spouting off on the  
reflector with the anti-rover views that you mention.  And while they  
would splutter that they are not anti-rover, but anti 'captive rover',  
they are in fact anti-rover, in addition to promulgating yet again a  
tiresome vendetta against some of the guys and gals who have done more to  
bring 'new blood' into the VHF and up world than any of the rest of us.

The captive rover is a mythical beast.  I know well and have the utmost  
respect for the guys and gals at W2SZ, and so I can comment most directly  
about their operation.  I know that they do NOT have captive rovers.  They  
encourage the rovers they assist to work everyone.  They have been largely  
silent but I believe that they too have been personally and deeply hurt by  
the slanderous comments made recently on this reflector and in the past  
regarding the mythical 'captive rovers' and the innuendos that have been  
tossed about.  I hope that the unfortunate remarks made by some on this  
reflector do not cause them or you to stop contesting.  For if they do,  
amateur radio will have suffered a great loss.

I went to Greylock and contested with the W2SZ group a couple of times,  
and was extremely impressed with their commitment to improving the VHF and  
up world for all of us by Elmering and bringing new blood into our  
community.  They see this as their mission and do us all a great service.   
I have heard them on multiple occasions remind rovers to do their utmost  
to work many 'other' stations rather than just W2SZ.  Nothing could be  
further from the truth than the false allegations to the contrary that are  
carelessly tossed around on this email list by a few individuals.

I also know the guys who make up W3CCX and W8GP, two other big multi-op  
stations in this part of the country, and while I have not visited their  
multioperator stations, I know them well enough so that I do not believe  
that they have captive rovers either.  So I really do not believe that the  
fictitious beast 'captive rover' exists at all.

I also know most of the rovers in this part of the country and know that  
they are not captive, and do not avoid working other stations [what a  
ridiculous and demeaning concept]!

I find that I frequently have significantly more difficulty working rovers  
[whom I hear quite well] than I do fixed stations.  I have attributed this  
to [1] the conditions under which they operate, [2] propagation conditions  
and geography, [3] deficiencies in my operating skills, and [4]  
deficiencies in my station setup.  I have worked to improve the percentage  
of successful contacts I make by working to improve my skills and my  
station.  I would never blame my inability to work them on an evil  
'conspiracy' of multiops and rovers to avoid working me or other hams.

I know that the rovers I have difficulty working are not 'captive rovers'  
for any station.  I realize that the way I can improve my record of  
working them is to improve my station and my operating skill, not rail  
about some mythical beast in a manner that hurts the entire VHF and  
contesting community on an internet reflector.  S#*& happens, and everyone  
at times is going to be in a position where a contact that absolutely  
'should' have occurred doesn't occur.  When this happens one should  
realize that its due to one of the four factors mentioned above, or due to  
S#*& happening at the other end [local interference, a blown preamp, a  
blown amp, forgetting to throw a switch, a stuck relay, a friendly visit  
 from 'Smokey' asking what is going on...the list of possibilities is  
endless], and not blame some ridiculous conspiracy.

To those of you who can't work the rovers whom you think you should be  
able to work AND who believe this is the result of a conspiracy among  
large multiop stations and dozens of rovers, I recommend that rather than  
posting your rants on the internet, you spend your time attempting to  
improve your stations and improve your operating skills.  And if you email  
the rovers whom you believe to be captive with sked requests or to set up  
a 'plan' before the next contest, I suspect that they will gladly set up a  
plan to work you.  But due to the vagaries of propagation, etc. NO contact  
should ever be considered to be guaranteed in advance.  If it were, there  
would be no need to actually RUN the contest ;)  I am not a great  
operator, but I have learned this.

Rest assured Tim, there is a silent majority that supports you and the  
other rovers and greatly appreciates your efforts!  Please continue to be  
active as you have been!

73,

Roger Rehr
W3SZ

On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 01:09:20 -0400, Tim Ertl (KE3HT) <ke3ht at ke3ht.org>  
wrote:

> What is a captive rover? I gather this from discussion on this list: I
> schedule ahead of the contest with only two or three stations. My June  
> logs
> (available on my web site) will show that I mainly worked three stations
> plus anyone else that could hear me. I pick rovers sites based on
> pre-planned scheds or the hope to work a distant station. I arranged my
> whole route around Southern and Northern PA to be able to work K8GP (284
> miles from FN10aw) and W2SZ (289miles from FN00xw) unlike some rovers who
> plan their routes for the most number of contacts. I have a 10 minute  
> set up
> time unlike some rovers that have 0 set up time. Some rovers can't do 250
> miles on the microwaves but they can make many hundreds of QSO's. My  
> intent
> is not to make lots of QSO's.
> So by definition I am captive.
>
> I am a rover who can not win in the rover category. As a single op rover
> there is no way I will even get close. I can't win any awards or see my  
> call
> in QST. Even if I could compete I don’t really have that type of  
> interest.
> The result is I only really spend time on long distance shots and  
> building a
> station to do long distance shots. Someday I hope to do moon bounce. My
> "FUN" is doing the distance. I really got started in this part of the  
> hobby
> because the distance fascinated me. I have done 356 miles up to 3ghz and
> 289miles up to 5ghz! I had lots of help designing and building my  
> station. I
> DO submit my logs to try to help the ARRL justify having these contests  
> not
> because I think I might win.
>
> Many other base stations I know of don't have much power, altitude,
> Antenna's or serious interest to build a distance capable station even
> though they might want to get the multipliers of the distant grids.
>
> -What is power? I run 42watts on 3456, 38watts pm 2304, 11watts on 5760.
> -What is altitude? I rover, need I explain that I go to the best places I
> can find?
> -What is antenna? I run a 6 foot dish. Can you say KW ERP!
> I may be captive but I am not a puny station.
>
> Because I want to do distance am I considered captive. Make me an illegal
> QSO and I can't use the contests to do my only contacts of the year!  
> Even if
> a big gun would talk to a station that does not count it would only be if
> they have some free time and most big guns don't have time to waste.
>
> My only concern with all these anti rover threads is that myself and many
> other rovers might not be able to contest in our own "FUN" ways. We have
> "FUN" rather than competing directly to win. What's wrong with that?
>
> Tell me, what should I do?
> Already one Rover has put his Rover up for sale! Some want me to quit?  
> Is it
> the loud minority or the silent majority speaking (E-mailing)? Should I  
> stop
> doing what gives me "FUN" to keep the contest pure? I would probably lose
> interest and put my station up for sale. What is the purpose of all this
> anti rover hatred? Do we really want to kill off rovers like me?
>
> Tim
>
> Tim Ertl KE3HT/r
> QSL via CBA
> http://www.ke3ht.org
> ke3ht at ke3ht.org
>
>

-- 
Roger Rehr
W3SZ
http://www.qsl.net/w3sz