[VHFcontesting] [NEWSVHF] Here's a Proposed Solution for Digital/Analog Operating

Wed Sep 17 10:07:16 EDT 2025

Not if there are rules in place to prevent this ("mode hopping").  Something like: QSO's may only be made on recognized digital/analog frequencies/portions of the bands and a digital and analog QSO can not be made back-to-back on the same frequency (or similar wording of no back-to-back analog/digital QSO's maybe similar to the HF NA sprints...).

I've been a proponent of a change in the contest rules similar to the format of the ARRL 10m contest and have submitted a couple of proposals to ARRL and heard crickets in return.  Analog Only, Digital Only and Mixed categories allowing 2 QSO's (one analog and one digital) on each band.  After reading others ideas, I also think additional encouragement may be needed to further promote analog operation - perhaps making analog QSO's worth additional points?  But is that enough to get the digital operators off digital and explore analog? 

There were a couple of times last weekend where I went an hour without making a QSO (4 bands, KW+ power on 6 and 2m, 100w on 222/432).  I called CQ on 6 and 2m SSB on the top of many hours and self-spotted making only a couple QSO's that way, worked only a few multi-ops and just one (and only one) rover on 1 band from 1 grid. Chat rooms got me a only a couple more skeds and QSO's.  It was beyond boring (thank goodness I could watch football on my iPad while operating).  Trying to get stations to QSY on FT8 to other bands was also a challenge and I had a higher failure rate than success rate.

73,
Ed K3DNE
EM94

> On 09/17/2025 9:27 AM EDT David R Buckwalter via VHFcontesting <vhfcontesting at contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting at contesting.com> wrote:
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> If you allow working a station both Digital and Analog on each band, all you will do is create “Mode Hopping’ …… “QSL the FN99, switch to FT8 and call me right here again, then we can move up a band and do it again”.
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> From: Ed Parish <k1ep.list at gmail.com mailto:k1ep.list at gmail.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2025 7:30 AM
> To: Terry Price <terry at directivesystems.com mailto:terry at directivesystems.com>
> Cc: K3SK at buckwalter.co mailto:K3SK at buckwalter.co; NEWS <NEWSVHF at mailman.qth.net mailto:NEWSVHF at mailman.qth.net>; VHF Contesting <VHFcontesting at contesting.com mailto:VHFcontesting at contesting.com>
> Subject: Re: [NEWSVHF] [VHFcontesting] Here's a Proposed Solution for Digital/Analog Operating
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> Well, if you go for a 48 hour contest, 24 analog and 24 digital, how about splitting it 12/24/12 to encourage people to work both modes and stick around? Instead of having people on for the first 24 and QRT or just get on for the second 24?
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> Ed Parish, K1EP
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> k1ep at arrl.net mailto:k1ep at arrl.net <mailto:k1ep at arrl.net mailto:k1ep at arrl.net>
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> On Tue, Sep 16, 2025, 20:38 Terry Price <terry at directivesystems.com mailto:terry at directivesystems.com <mailto:terry at directivesystems.com mailto:terry at directivesystems.com> > wrote:
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> Well, I said make the contest a full 48 hrs, 24 digital and 24 analog.
> Comments about too many modes is kinda correct, you don't know where to go.
> You call CQ on SSB/CW and you miss FT8 folks, go to FT8 you miss analog
> folks. That's why I think having two segments really fits well. Both modes
> get evening, morning and day. If someone is opposed to digital, they
> operate whichever segment is analog. This also would reduce the "Sunday
> afternoon blues" when you'll do anything to work someone.
>  
> So right now, there is SOLP and SOHP and analog only, for the folks that
> only want to work digital, there is no digital award only that I am aware
> of. Yes, it may be creating another category but it's not just so "everyone
> wins" Digital isn't going anywhere and to think the league will remove
> digital from VHF contests is not realistic. Anyone who has contested for a
> while knows that FT8 is NOT a contest mode, yes you can dig out folks that
> are too weak for cw or folks that don't operate cw, but neither is Q65,
> MSK144 for that matter but folks don't abuse those.
>  
> I for one see nothing wrong with an analog only, digital only and for us
> guttens' both modes - and awards, I personally would love a 48 hour VHF
> contest as long as there is activity to keep me awake. I couldn't make the
> CQ VHF analog but I did operate the digital and if the results are correct
> I was #1 in the US. I operated two K3's, one on 6 and one driving a
> transverter for two. The challenge was keeping both going and trying not to
> miss anything. It wasn't the same fun as analog and recognising someone by
> their voice or fist but it wasn't that bad.
>  
> I've been contesting since 1978 when I worked with WA8LXJ in Kentucky. I've
> singleop'ed, multiop'ed, and roved. I loved roving but getting folks to QSY
> is difficult on FT8 and you miss a lot when folks are hanging out on FT8
> all the time so dividing the contest into two sections would also help
> rovers and hopefully spur more to get on. Is the idea perfect, of course
> not, what in life is perfect?
>  
> Terry
> Terry Price - W8ZN
> Directive Systems and Engineering
> 703-754-3876
>  
>  
> On Tue, Sep 16, 2025 at 4:43 PM David R Buckwalter via VHFcontesting <
> vhfcontesting at contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting at contesting.com <mailto:vhfcontesting at contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting at contesting.com> > wrote:
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> > Here is my 3-1/2¢ on using analog and digital modes for the ARRL VHF
> > contests.
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> > There is an easy solution. Just read on ===
> >  
> > First, it is not just about FT8. Some operators use other digital modes as
> > well. This past weekend’s contest I logged CW, SSB, FT8, MSK, Q65 and
> > JT65 contacts.
> >  
> > Separating the contest for either analog or digital format is dumb. There
> > are already too many things going on in life to worry about dedicating
> > another weekend for contesting. Splitting the same weekend into slots
> > for
> > analog and digital is a bad idea. Which format gets the morning tropo time
> > slot? What format gets the daytime Sporadic E? Does MSK144 for meteor
> > scatter get assigned to the mornings, evenings, night, or afternoon? What
> > about those like myself that add multipliers using digital modes to work
> > EME? Do we get to use digital when the moon is available at our location?
> >  
> > Over the past 3 to 4 years there has been much discussion on this subject
> > and the one significant point made is Analog operators (SSB & CW) will not
> > work digital stations. In most cases the analog stations don’t even own
> > digital equipment or software. However, whether they choose to or not,
> > Digital operators have the ability and many do work ‘Mixed Mode’, both
> > digital and analog.
> >  
> > Considering this, the most logical thing to do is change the rules for
> > scoring and operating categories. Keep the current operating categories
> > including ‘Analog Only’. Then, add a new ‘Digital Only’ category. Create
> > a
> > points incentive for analog contacts. As an example, use the current point
> > values for digital modes, then add 1 point to those values for each analog
> > contact. A 144MHz now 1 point, will be 2 points if an analog contact is
> > made, a 222MHz contact is now 2 points and will be 3 if it is for an analog
> > contact. This provides an incentive for ‘Mixed Mode’ stations to seek out
> > and work analog contacts. Still permit only one valid contact per band
> > with
> > any station. If a station is previously worked digital and then is later
> > worked analog, allow the higher point analog contact, letting the previous
> > logged digital contact to become the ‘DUPE’. ‘Digital Only’ are
> > competing
> > with other ‘Digital Only’ even if they work a ‘Mixed Mode’ station. It’s
> > the same for ‘Analog Only’ stations. There is no downside to this method
> > of scoring.
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> >  
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> > Yes, I know the logging software will need to be revised. But that’s got
> > nothing to do with making everybody happy and increasing activity.
> >  
> >  
> >  
> > FWIW – I have been VHF contesting since 1980
> >  
> > Dave - K3SK - FM07
> >  
> >  
> >  
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> > 
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