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Re: [Amps] 160m mosfet linear amplifier problem with ferrite cores

To: amps@contesting.com, David Cutter <d.cutter@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Amps] 160m mosfet linear amplifier problem with ferrite cores
From: sasas asasas <tzitzikas_ee@yahoo.com>
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2010 05:03:39 -0700 (PDT)
List-post: <amps@contesting.com">mailto:amps@contesting.com>
The linear have been constructed by me (if you mean the manufacter of linear 
amplifier).
The prototype have been constructed by schematic designer and you can see a 
photo here:
http://www.tzitzikas.webs.com/linear_first.jpg ;

Also, this linear have  been successfully constructed by another radio amateur. 
You can see photos here:
http://www.tzitzikas.webs.com/linear_working3.jpg

http://www.tzitzikas.webs.com/linear_working1.jpg

http://www.tzitzikas.webs.com/linear_working2.jpg       
                    
Both of these linear are using International Rectifier IRFP360 mosfets. I use 
this time Siliconix IRFP360 mosfets. Both of amateurs claims that their linear 
amplifier gives at least 450w r.f power at the outupt stage.

---------------------------------------------------------------------  
http://tzitzikas.site90.net (tzitzikas site) 
http://forum.tzitzikas.site90.net (tzitzikas forum)  
---------------------------------------------------------------------

--- On Sun, 4/18/10, David Cutter <d.cutter@ntlworld.com> wrote:

From: David Cutter <d.cutter@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Amps] 160m mosfet linear amplifier problem with ferrite cores
To: "sasas asasas" <tzitzikas_ee@yahoo.com>, amps@contesting.com
Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 4:49 AM



 
Are you using the same manufacturer as your friends?  

 
If so, yours should be the similar performance unless 
something is wrong.
 
David

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  sasas 
  asasas 
  To: amps@contesting.com ; David 
  Cutter 
  Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2010 12:12 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [Amps] 160m mosfet linear 
  amplifier problem with ferrite cores
  

  
    
    
      hi. i am not use insulators between mosfet and heatsink in order to have 
the minimum thermal resistance. I 
        am using only silicon thermal conductive paste to 
        decrease the thermal resistance. So, the heatsink is connected with the 
drain of each mosfet and the 
        heatsink has the drain voltage.
I am 
        using 12 Siliconix's IRFP360 mosfets, but i have order and soon i will 
        replace them with International Rectifier IRFP360 mosfets. Propably 
this 
        is the reason, that the amplifier don't give many watts at 
        outupt.
The other reason, is that the material of ferrite cores (43 
        material) is not the proper for 1-2mhz frequences. What do you 
        think??

--- On Sun, 4/18/10, David Cutter 
        <d.cutter@ntlworld.com> wrote:

        
From: 
          David Cutter <d.cutter@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Amps] 160m 
          mosfet linear amplifier problem with ferrite cores
To: "sasas 
          asasas" <tzitzikas_ee@yahoo.com>, amps@contesting.com
Date: 
          Sunday, April 18, 2010, 3:50 AM


          
          I see you are using hex socket screws.  It 
          is very easy to over-tighten screws to fix plastic devices to a 
          heatsink, I've seen them crack after a little time in the field due 
to 
          expansion and contraction against an over-tight fixing.  The 
          crack can be invisible to the naked eye initially but causes 
          failure of the device.  Mounting torque is 1.13Nm which is quite 
          low.  
           
          The mounting tab is the drain and you could look 
          at the heatsink isolation. Is there an isolation insulator 
          under each device or is the whole heatsink 
          isolated?   
           
          I could be drifting off the subject, but fixing 
          small errors can often chase away the big ones.
           
          David
          G3UNA
           
            
          
            ----- 
            Original Message ----- 
            From: 
            sasas 
            asasas 
            To: 
            amps@contesting.com ; David 
            Cutter 
            Sent: 
            Sunday, April 18, 2010 10:41 AM
            Subject: 
            Re: [Amps] 160m mosfet linear amplifier problem with ferrite 
            cores
            

            
              
              
                Some additional photos from my 
                  linear:

http://tzitzikas.webs.com/fet20.JPG
http://tzitzikas.webs.com/linear20.JPG
http://tzitzikas.webs.com/linear21.JPG
http://tzitzikas.webs.com/linear22.JPG
http://tzitzikas.webs.com/fet21.JPG
http://tzitzikas.webs.com/pompos20.JPG


--- 
                  On Sun, 4/18/10, David Cutter <d.cutter@ntlworld.com> 
                  wrote:

                  
From: 
                    David Cutter <d.cutter@ntlworld.com>
Subject: 
                    Re: [Amps] 160m mosfet linear amplifier problem with 
ferrite 
                    cores
To: "sasas asasas" <tzitzikas_ee@yahoo.com>, 
                    amps@contesting.com
Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 2:35 
                    AM


                    
                    

                    I've looked again at the jpg and I 
                    think you have used trifilar windings, so, that's my 
                    first idea more or less gone.  Imbalance can be 
                    due to poor coupling between the windings themselves or 
                    imbalance in the driving currents.  With high voltage 
                    supplies, balance error should be small (compared to say a 
                    12V amplifier where a small difference in voltages can show 
                    a large imbalance %).  If you could measure the current 
                    in each half of the primary that would tell you the whole 
                    story: you will need a HF current probe, preferably 2 
probes 
                    and dual trace scope which will also tell you about 
                    cross-conduction.  
                     
                    Another thought: you have 6 
                    transistors in parallel in each half and emitter (sorry 
                    - source) degeneration.  Did you try matching the 
                    FETs for gain or phase delay?  If not, it's conceivable 
                    that one side is conducting harder or for longer than the 
                    other side and causing an imbalance.  I don't know if 
                    the source resistor is the optimum value for 
                    mis-matched FETs, but a higher value would increase 
                    negative feedback and help with this; you have oodles of 
                    gain to sacrifice.  Along the same lines, the input 
                    drive to each FET may need optimising for the same 
                    reason.  Check all your resistor values, one might 
                    be a dud.
                     
                    This is all armchair speculation, I 
                    don't have enough experience for better detail.  
                    Someone with modelling experience could probably do this 
                    quite quickly.  
                     
                    Alex has probably got the answer 
                    regarding core material.  
                     
                    David
                    G3UNA
                    
                      ----- 
                      Original 

                      
                        
                        
                          And how can i repair this 
                            problem???

                            



                              You might consider imbalance 
                              in each side of the primary which will cause a 
net 
                              dc to pass, saturation and over-heating.  
                              This may be rubbish but it could get others 
                              thinking along a different 
                              path.

David
G3UNA


> HI. i 
                              have constructed this linear amplifier 500w rms 
                              (2kw pep) (50ohm) with 12 mosfet irfp360, 
http://tzitzikas.webs.com/linear500w.jpg 
                              for 160m band.
> When i gave 3watts of 
                              driving r.f power, it gave to output only 190w at 
                              106VDC (6A current). Two radio amateurs who have 
                              construct this linear claim tha it gives 
                              500w
> r.f power at 110vdc.
> But when 
                              i tried to give 4watts of driving r.f power the 
                              ferrite Cores (43 material)
> of transformer 
                              T3 broken! Which do you think is the 
                              problem??
> 
                        






      
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