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Re: [Amps] Measuring IMD

To: amps@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [Amps] Measuring IMD
From: Jim W7RY <w7ry@centurytel.net>
Reply-to: w7ry@centurytel.net
Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2013 06:56:34 -0800
List-post: <amps@contesting.com">mailto:amps@contesting.com>
Remember the tune meter position on the Collins 30L-1?

73
Jim W7RY

On 11/3/2013 6:31 AM, Karl-Arne Markström wrote:
The circuit in the ARRL Handbook was intended to establish the static load-line 
when tuning up,
but by adding an oscilloscope it could also be used for indicating dynamic 
linearity.
Similar circuits were used in many manually and servo-tuned amplifiers. 73/
Karl-Arne
SM0AOM

----Ursprungligt meddelande----
Från: audioguy@q.com
Datum: 2013-11-03 15:24
Till: "Karl-Arne Markström"<sm0aom@telia.com>, <g8on@fsmail.net>, 
<amps@contesting.com>
Ärende: Re: [Amps] Measuring IMD

A similar linearity-detecting scheme was used in a 3-1000Z design from
the 1970 ARRL Handbook. "The SS-70 2-KW Amplifier", pp 204-208.

It used diode RF detectors in the cathode and plate circuits, a
"balance" pot and a 50-0-50 uA front-panel meter.

I have no idea how well it worked, but this thread rang a bell and I had
to go look it up. It would be interesting to try it. If the mechanical
meter turned out to be inadequate, a connector for an external scope
could be added.

73,
Jim N7CXI

On 11/3/2013 3:10 AM, Karl-Arne Markström wrote:
It is sad to read about the death of Warren Bruene. One of the really great in 
RF engineering have left us.

Regarding the use of linearity monitoring with diode detectors at the input and 
output, I recall this being a part of the
servo-tuning system used in the AEG-Telefunken 20 kW transmitters  that I 
worked with in the 80' and part of the 90's.
(Picture at the bottom of this page: http://www.seefunknetz.de/sdj.htm)

By first tuning for resonance in all circuits, then loading for the proper load 
line in the PA and finally adjusting the drive level
to a point just below where the transfer function started to be curved, a good 
linearity (at least - 35 dB IM3 relative one tone) was assured.

It also was part of the envelope-feedback linearisation system that made the 
last few dB's improvement of IMD suppression possible.

By using this form of linearity monitoring, the most offensive cases of 
overdrive or misadjustment are possible to identify at a glance.
More accurate measurements require a spectrum analyser or a selective level 
meter capable of measuring adjacent channel suppression either with multi-tone 
driving signals or noise.

73/
Karl-Arne
SM0AOM
73/
Karl-Arne

----Ursprungligt meddelande----
Från: g8on@fsmail.net
Datum: 2013-11-03 11:28
Till: <amps@contesting.com>
Ärende: Re: [Amps] Measuring IMD

A very simple method which is adequate for most amateur use is to couple diode 
detectors to the input and output of the amplifier. The input detector goes to 
the X input of an oscilloscope and the output to the Y input. Adjust the 
coupling to get more or less equal voltages. The oscilloscope only needs to 
work at audio so an old tube Heathkit scope will do! When the line on the 
screen as you talk is straight, the linearity is adequate. With a 2 tone test, 
you can see by the curvature of the line such things as too low a standing 
plate current, poor grid circuit regulation and overdrive, and by making 
voltage measurements on the graticule, you can calculate 3rd and 5th order 
distortion. See the 1964 edition of 'Single Sideband Principles and Circuits' 
by Pappenfus, Bruene (who died the other month) and Schoenike.

With a solid state PA, a spectrum analyser is really needed because you have to 
consider the much worse high order IMD products (7,9,11) which tend not to be 
negligible. Even with LDMOS, which is as bad as bipolar on linearity.

73

Peter G3RZP
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