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Re: [TenTec] Re: Rudimentary SWR question...

To: tentec@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Re: Rudimentary SWR question...
From: Bill Fuqua <wlfuqu00@uky.edu>
Reply-to: tentec@contesting.com
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 15:30:11 -0400
List-post: <mailto:tentec@contesting.com>
I did not say the antenna had to be resonant but the antenna system must be resonant to be effective if the antenna is short.
You can make the antenna nearly as small as you want but to match the impedance you must make the system resonant. And the shorter it is the higher the Q becomes if it is to be an effective radiator.
The high Q may appear to you to be in your tuner. You have to retune it when you move from one end of the band to the other in some cases only 10's of KHz. But it is there. The high standing waves in the transmission line are a manifestation of the higher Q once you match the impedance of the system so that you can force the signal out thru the antenna to the air. Have you not noticed by experience that the greater the mismatch the more selective the antenna tuner is and the greater the tendency of the capacitors to arc over or the coils to over heat? If this is not evidence of higher Q I don't know what is.
Another way to look at it is when you shorten the antenna (less that a half wavelength) the radiation resistance goes down and it becomes capacitive. So you add a loading coil. The capacitive reactance must be compensated by an equal inductive reactance and the resistance is lower. Higher Q. X/R is greater!!! And I'll say again that Q is not only a ratio of reactance and resistance but is a ratio of stored energy and energy per cycle passing thru a physical system. That system may be mechanical or electrical or a combination of the two ( quartz crystal for example).


73
Bill wa4lav



At 12:48 PM 10/20/2003 -0500, you wrote:
Interesting . . .

I use my 88 ft 20-meter EDZ on 75 SSB and most stations say it is equal to
or exceeds the signal from my resonant 80-meter full-wave horizontal loop.
The first time I used it on 75 there was total disbelief among the group
that an antenna that short and non-resonant at that could even work, much
less put out such as strong signal.

It turns out that any wire antenna that is at least 0.3 wavelengths long on
a given band will radiate a signal whose strength is almost immeasurably
different from that of a half-wave dipole.

My experiences with the EDZ on 75 support and confirm that.

Resonance of the antenna is a convenience for line matching. It has little
to do with radiation efficiency. This is not an opinion but a well
established fact in the professional antenna field. Consider also that in
the Yagi beam, only the driven element is "resonant" while the other
elements are intentionally made either too long or too short to be resonant.
And in some designs, none of the elements are resonant and the driving point
impedance is complex requiring such approaches as T, gamma and beta matches.

73/72, George
Amateur Radio W5YR -  the Yellow Rose of Texas
Fairview, TX 30 mi NE of Dallas in Collin county EM13QE
"Starting the 58th year and it just keeps getting better!"
w5yr@att.net





----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Fuqua" <wlfuqu00@uky.edu>
To: <tentec@contesting.com>
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2003 11:08 AM
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Re: Rudimentary SWR question...


> The reason why half wave dipoles are half wave length is not for a > specific impedance but that they are resonant. > Small antennas like the half wave dipole are not effective radiators unless > they are resonant. Resonance can be provided by a combination of the dipole > antenna and other elements such as inductances, capacitances or > combinations ( antenna tuner and transmission line). > Resonance is a means of storing oscillating energy. That is what Q is > all about. Q = (total stored energy)/ (energy entering and leaving the > system each cycle). At resonance the energy stored in the half wave dipole > manifest itself as larger currents and voltages than those feeding it. The > alternating current and voltage build up until the amount of radiated > energy equals the energy that is being applied. This is called equilibrium > ( power in = power out). > This is also why effective short antenna systems have higher Q than > half wave dipoles. Magnetic loops, short antennas (whips etc) with antenna > tuners or what have you all will have higher Q than half wave dipole > antennas due to the fact that higher currents and/or voltages must exist in > the antenna for the same radiated power. > There are effective non resonant antennas but they are larger than a > half wave dipole. Horn antennas are an example. Helical antennas or Discone > ( sort of a circular horn) antenna. And antennas that are a collection of > resonant antennas that have overlapping resonances such as a Log Periodic > Dipole array. > > 73 > Bill wa4lav > > > At 08:49 AM 10/20/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > Watts Reflected at the Mismatch.................At VSWR indicated of: > > > > > > ..........1 watt.................................................. > > > ......... 30 watts................................................. > > > 3.4:1 > > > > > If you use an antenna tuner, most of the above indicated > > > reflected power will be re-reflected back up to the antenna, > > > and most of that will then be radiated! Losing only the > > > indicated reflected percentages once again and a bit lost > > > in I^2R loss in the transmission line (a real tiny amount). > > > Antenna tuners also have some loss in the coil, again little. > > > This is absolutely true even though the vswr between > > > the tuner and the transmission line/antenna system will remain > > > at the indicated numbers. The tuner "isolates" the rig from > > > the returning reflected voltage, so the rig will continue > > > to put out all the power it can at a set of control/drive/ > > > tune up settings. > > > >My understanding (from reading Reflections II) is that this power is > >re-reflected regardless of whether a tuner is present. Assuming that your > >transmitter can handle the mismatch w/o folding back output power, there > >should be no difference in performance SWR wise. > > > > > And this explanation is the ENTIRE story/difference between > > > an antenna which is resonant at a particular frequency, and > > > another antenna which is not resonant and introduces the > > > above examples of mismatch and vswr as a result. That is > > > the ONLY difference between resonant and non-resonant > > > antennas! > > > >However, one thing I have noticed (empirical data only) is that the > >radiation pattern of an antenna is affected when not operating at the > >designed frequency. For example, I found that my 2 meter beam (vertically > >polarized) did not have the same directivity when using it to receive FM > >broadcast. Similarly, if you use an antenna tuner to "force" an antenna to > >work on a band for which it is not designed, don't expect the radiation > >pattern to be the same. Thus, while the antenna may be radiating almost all > >the energy, the communication may not be as effective as some energy will be > >radiated in other directions. > > > >Mark > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >TenTec mailing list > >TenTec@contesting.com > >http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/tentec > > _______________________________________________ > TenTec mailing list > TenTec@contesting.com > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/tentec

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