I'm not a member please remove from email
thank you
Nomad
----- Original Message -----
From: <towertalk-request@contesting.com>
To: <towertalk@contesting.com>
Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 3:07 PM
Subject: TowerTalk Digest, Vol 31, Issue 28
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Ground level and sea level/KGO (Pat Barthelow)
> 2. Re: Ground level and sea level (Michael Tope)
> 3. ASL vs HAAT (Jim Jarvis)
> 4. Re: Procedure to lower a mast (Dino Darling)
> 5. Re: Procedure to lower a mast (Rick Scott)
> 6. Re: Ground level and sea level (Lee Buller)
> 7. Beefing up Aluminum Beam Elements (jim fox)
> 8. Re: I improved my tower cam a bit (Mark - AA6DX)
> 9. Re: Beefing up Aluminum Beam Elements (Dino Darling)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 10:56:03 -0700
> From: "Pat Barthelow" <aa6eg@hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Ground level and sea level/KGO
> To: kd4e@verizon.net, TOWERTALK@contesting.com
> Message-ID: <BAY106-F2420E3A642046533159CCAFBDB0@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>
> Doc, KD4E said:
> >One of the best locations I ever worked from was along the edge
> >of a bay in northeastern Mass ... amazing how that junk wire
> >antenna fed through junk catv cable from a Heath SB-101 got out!
> >
> >Proximity to salt water and a clear shot east across the Atlantic
> >is the best!
>
>
> KGO in SF, 50KW Radio 810 has a huge signal beamed from Alaska to Central
> America at night.
> Their vertical array is in extra salty water in SF Bay. (shared with salt
> evaporation ponds next door.) The wide copper straps at each vertical
tower
> base only have to go about 10 ft horizonal before they submerge in the
extra
> salty water.
>
> See; Click on:
> http://groups.msn.com/kgotour/kgotour.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=78
>
> http://groups.msn.com/kgotour/kgotour.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=63
>
> http://groups.msn.com/kgotour/kgotour.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=49
>
> http://groups.msn.com/kgotour/kgotour.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=68
>
> for pics of a dream site for an Antenna Broadcast Engineer.
>
> 73, DX, de Pat Barthelow AA6EG aa6eg@hotmail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:05:25 -0700
> From: "Michael Tope" <W4EF@dellroy.com>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Ground level and sea level
> To: "Tom Rauch" <w8ji@contesting.com>, <kd4e@verizon.net>, "towertalk
> reflector" <towertalk@contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <00ae01c583e7$a045a510$17f69580@1800xp>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Yeah, I am at 1700ft ASL which sounds impressive until you realize the
> the mountain next to me is around 4000ft ASL :) If you ever want
> experience first hand the contrast between a good DX QTH and a bad
> DX QTH all you need to do is come over here to my QTH and operate.
> I have both depending on what direction I am working towards. Towards
> the Pacific it is great - I work pretty much everything, even with crappy
> antennas. Toward West Africa working from here competitively is like
> trying to pee up a rope. Most of the time the only thing I hear is the
hiss
> coming from the speaker :)
>
> 73 de Mike, W4EF...................................
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom Rauch" <w8ji@contesting.com>
>
> >
> > That would be good too, but you gave info about the
> > surroundings.
> >
> > What seems to happen is someone says "I have an antenna that
> > is 991 ft ASL so it........." Fill in the blank with you
> > want. There isn't any reference to what's around it.
> >
> > I can't visualize if it is in a hole 500 feet deep or on top
> > of a 500 ft steeply sloped rise.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 14:11:59 -0400
> From: "Jim Jarvis" <jimjarvis@comcast.net>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] ASL vs HAAT
> To: <towertalk@contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <KFEELJAIGCMCCCAELGPIKEJCCPAA.jimjarvis@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> As Dave Robbins pointed out, topo maps indicate altitude ASL.
> So do aeronautical charts. It's easier to talk about the
> printed numbers, than it is to calculate height above average
> terrain...which almost certainly will vary, based on azimuth.
>
> And then, there is the question...why 5,000 or 8,000 asl?
> The answer is....there's RF up there than never gets down
> to the flatlands! (or so the lore goes.) :)
>
> N2EA
> jimjarvis@ieee.org
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 11:25:01 -0700
> From: Dino Darling <k6rix@earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Procedure to lower a mast
> To: towertalk@contesting.com
> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20050708110331.040dae50@mail.earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> Do you have the ability to bolt on a winch at the top of the flat-top? If
> so...
>
> =======================================
> Set the antennas to NORTH (or south or east or west) and MARK IT!
>
> Use a shaft clamp (or muffler clamps) to hold the mast from falling down
> through the tower.
> (McMaster Carr
>
<http://www.mcmaster.com/itm/find.ASP?tab=find&context=psrchDtlLink&fasttrac
k=False&searchstring=6436K27>6436K27
> or equivalent)
>
> Connect/secure the winch cable to the bottom of the mast, just above the
rotor.
> (assuming you have a rotor and not a rotatable tower)
>
> Depending on what type of thrust bearing you have, you will need to loosen
> them enough to allow the mast to slip through. They will also help
support
> the mast as it goes down.
>
> Bring the mast up with the winch, just enough to remove the rotor. You
can
> tie the rotor out of the way or lower it down for inspection since it is
out.
>
> Get back up to the flat-top, loosen the shaft clamp and lower the mast
with
> the winch. The winch does all the work!
>
> MARK THE BEAM LOCATION ON THE MAST!
>
> Loosen the TH7 and continue to lower the mast. The mast should slip
> through the boom-to-mast clamp.
>
> When you get the mast down far enough to reach your antenna, re-install
the
> shaft clamp and go to work!
>
> ======================================
>
> I do not have the advantage of seeing your set up. Every tower is
> different and therefore have different ways of attack. Use what I've
given
> above at your own risk and modify as necessary. When in doubt, hire a
> professional! Be safe!!!
>
>
> At 12:20 PM 07/08/2005 -0400, you wrote:
> >I have a 24ft chrome moly mast on my 100ft Rohn 45 tower. 10ft of the
mast
> >are in the tower and held by two thrust bearings. 14ft are above the
flat
> >top
> >section with a Hygain TH7 mounted about a foot above the top section and
a
> >Cushcraft 402CD mounted about 12ft above the top section.
> >
> >I need to get to the 402CD and therefore will need to lower the mast.
Since
> >this mast is quite heavy, I'd like to know a safe procedure to do so.
> >
> >73, Greg AG5W
> >_______________________________________________
> >
> >See: http://www.mscomputer.com for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
> >Weather Stations", and lot's more. Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with
> >any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >TowerTalk mailing list
> >TowerTalk@contesting.com
> >http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>
> Dino...k6rix@earthlink.net
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:29:10 -0700
> From: Rick Scott <rickn7hj@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Procedure to lower a mast
> To: towertalk@contesting.com
> Message-ID: <3447df1b0507081129576c4dd7@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> In this case would renting a bucket truck be a better value ????
>
> Scotty N7HJ
>
>
> On 7/8/05, Dino Darling <k6rix@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > Do you have the ability to bolt on a winch at the top of the flat-top?
If
> > so...
> >
> > =======================================
> > Set the antennas to NORTH (or south or east or west) and MARK IT!
> >
> > Use a shaft clamp (or muffler clamps) to hold the mast from falling down
> > through the tower.
> > (McMaster Carr
> >
<http://www.mcmaster.com/itm/find.ASP?tab=find&context=psrchDtlLink&fasttrac
k=False&searchstring=6436K27>6436K27
> > or equivalent)
> >
> > Connect/secure the winch cable to the bottom of the mast, just above the
rotor.
> > (assuming you have a rotor and not a rotatable tower)
> >
> > Depending on what type of thrust bearing you have, you will need to
loosen
> > them enough to allow the mast to slip through. They will also help
support
> > the mast as it goes down.
> >
> > Bring the mast up with the winch, just enough to remove the rotor. You
can
> > tie the rotor out of the way or lower it down for inspection since it is
out.
> >
> > Get back up to the flat-top, loosen the shaft clamp and lower the mast
with
> > the winch. The winch does all the work!
> >
> > MARK THE BEAM LOCATION ON THE MAST!
> >
> > Loosen the TH7 and continue to lower the mast. The mast should slip
> > through the boom-to-mast clamp.
> >
> > When you get the mast down far enough to reach your antenna, re-install
the
> > shaft clamp and go to work!
> >
> > ======================================
> >
> > I do not have the advantage of seeing your set up. Every tower is
> > different and therefore have different ways of attack. Use what I've
given
> > above at your own risk and modify as necessary. When in doubt, hire a
> > professional! Be safe!!!
> >
> >
> > At 12:20 PM 07/08/2005 -0400, you wrote:
> > >I have a 24ft chrome moly mast on my 100ft Rohn 45 tower. 10ft of the
mast
> > >are in the tower and held by two thrust bearings. 14ft are above the
flat
> > >top
> > >section with a Hygain TH7 mounted about a foot above the top section
and a
> > >Cushcraft 402CD mounted about 12ft above the top section.
> > >
> > >I need to get to the 402CD and therefore will need to lower the mast.
Since
> > >this mast is quite heavy, I'd like to know a safe procedure to do so.
> > >
> > >73, Greg AG5W
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >
> > >See: http://www.mscomputer.com for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
> > >Weather Stations", and lot's more. Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with
> > >any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >TowerTalk mailing list
> > >TowerTalk@contesting.com
> > >http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
> >
> > Dino...k6rix@earthlink.net
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > See: http://www.mscomputer.com for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
Weather Stations", and lot's more. Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with any
questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TowerTalk mailing list
> > TowerTalk@contesting.com
> > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:38:46 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Lee Buller <k0wa@swbell.net>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Ground level and sea level
> To: TowerTalk Reflector <towertalk@contesting.com>
> Message-ID: <20050708183846.11585.qmail@web81310.mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>
> Back in the 80s when I was in broadcasting, the FCC
> always looked at height above sea level...even in
> Kansas. The FAA seems to be very interested in ASL
> also. (Something about NOT fly planes into mountains)
> I think that surveyors use ASL as a constant that
> works anywhere on earth. That way, the FCC (or
> anyone) can then calculate Height Above Averate
> Terrain or HAAT. HAAT seems a little more interesting
> to me because it reflects or describes the actual area
> of your tower or antenna. HAAT is calculated on
> several radials from the tower and then an average is
> taken. At Kansas State University, KSDB (student run
> radio station) had at HAAT for -38 feet. Yep, they
> were broadcasting in a hole or a bowl. Coupled with a
> 100 watts and 600 feet of 1" hardline...we could get
> out to the city limits of Manhattan. I moved the
> station to a 200 foot tower outside of town on a high
> bluff. One side of the tower was 350 feet above
> average terain...but on the south side of the tower
> the average was 105 feet. I cannot remember how many
> radials I had to run, but I think it was 8 or more
> Mahattan is located in a river valley (not all of
> Kansas is flat either and 14% is forest land as well).
> So, knowing the ASL of a given point then you can do
> the simple math of finding HAAT...which I think
> matters more...especially on VHF/UHF....and maybe HF.
>
> Your mileage may vary
>
> Lee - K0WA
>
>
> Common sense is in short supply - get some and use it.
> If you can't find any common sense, ask for help from
> somebody that has some common sense. - Lee Buller
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 08:44:15 -1000
> From: "jim fox" <w0hfg@hotmail.com>
> Subject: [TowerTalk] Beefing up Aluminum Beam Elements
> To: towertalk@contesting.com
> Message-ID: <BAY101-F6B8283FDF59A666226DF5E1DB0@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>
> I wonder if anyone has and comments on strengthening beam elements by
> inserting the next size smaller tubing inside the original there-by
doubling
> the thickness, but not increasing the outside diameter of the elements..
> I have a Tennadyne Log that just is not physically strong enough to
last
> out here in the wind and ice of Western Kansas.. I plan to increase the
> tubing thickness for the longest two elements for approx the 1st 10 ft out
> from the boom. What I'm wondering is, will this change the loading or SWR
of
> the antenna ?? Comments welcome.. Jim / W0HFG
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:50:39 -0700
> From: "Mark - AA6DX" <AA6DX@ARRL.NET>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] I improved my tower cam a bit
> To: "FireBrick" <w9ol@billnjudy.com>, "TowerTalk List"
> <towertalk@contesting.com>, "Antenna List" <Antennas@mailman.qth.net>
> Message-ID: <009b01c583ed$ef884460$1108a8c0@desk>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Appears to be broke down ... all diffusticated ... shack cam OK ... Is
it
> condensation, or .. camera went doo-doo?
> Like the idea swell, though! 73 Mark
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "FireBrick" <w9ol@billnjudy.com>
> To: "TowerTalk List" <towertalk@contesting.com>; "Antenna List"
> <Antennas@mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 7:13 AM
> Subject: [TowerTalk] I improved my tower cam a bit
>
>
> > Off topic protection:
> > "you can just see the elements of my antenna at the top of picture 1"
> >
> > I found a better auto iris lens on eBay.
> >
> > you can see the scope of beautiful Historic District of Harwood Heights,
> > IL
> > at either of the two url's below.
> > http://24.14.55.211:8080/
> >
> > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/w9ol/WX/HH.htm
> >
> > total cost of tower cam is now about $125.
> >
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------
> > But I forgot all about the Amnesia Conference!!
> > -----------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Bill H. in Chicagoland
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > See: http://www.mscomputer.com for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
> > Weather Stations", and lot's more. Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with
> > any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TowerTalk mailing list
> > TowerTalk@contesting.com
> > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.10/43 - Release Date: 7/6/2005
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 12:06:56 -0700
> From: Dino Darling <k6rix@earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Beefing up Aluminum Beam Elements
> To: towertalk@contesting.com
> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20050708120358.02634070@mail.earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> You should have this book!!!
>
> http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/books/0995.html
>
> It can answer all your questions!
>
> Adding mass to the inside of the element will not change your SWR, but may
> cause your element to physically fail. There is no easy answer to your
> question! Buy the book and get some help with the math if you need to.
It
> is an EXCELLENT resourse!!!!
>
>
> At 08:44 AM 07/08/2005 -1000, you wrote:
> >I wonder if anyone has and comments on strengthening beam elements by
> >inserting the next size smaller tubing inside the original there-by
doubling
> >the thickness, but not increasing the outside diameter of the elements..
> > I have a Tennadyne Log that just is not physically strong enough to
last
> >out here in the wind and ice of Western Kansas.. I plan to increase the
> >tubing thickness for the longest two elements for approx the 1st 10 ft
out
> >from the boom. What I'm wondering is, will this change the loading or SWR
of
> >the antenna ?? Comments welcome.. Jim / W0HFG
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >
> >See: http://www.mscomputer.com for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless
> >Weather Stations", and lot's more. Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with
> >any questions and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >TowerTalk mailing list
> >TowerTalk@contesting.com
> >http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>
> Dino...k6rix@earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> TowerTalk mailing list
> TowerTalk@contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk
>
>
> End of TowerTalk Digest, Vol 31, Issue 28
> *****************************************
>
>
_______________________________________________
See: http://www.mscomputer.com for "Self Supporting Towers", "Wireless Weather
Stations", and lot's more. Call Toll Free, 1-800-333-9041 with any questions
and ask for Sherman, W2FLA.
_______________________________________________
TowerTalk mailing list
TowerTalk@contesting.com
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