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Re: [TowerTalk] Tuning Fan Dipoles?

To: Jim Lux <jimlux@earthlink.net>, towertalk@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tuning Fan Dipoles?
From: Grant Saviers <grants2@pacbell.net>
Date: Sun, 04 May 2014 15:48:41 -0700
List-post: <towertalk@contesting.com">mailto:towertalk@contesting.com>
Thanks to Dan AC6LA, who recently posted the Cebik article link that explains a good way to model fan dipoles.

Cebik article on using "zero" length transmission lines to connect fan elements:
http://www.antennex.com/w4rnl/col0507/amod111.html

In the past, couldn't get sensible results from EZNEC, even Pro4, with my fan dipole models. Converting to the transmission line feed method between dipoles yielded a model that is very close to an 80-40-20 built with cut and try methods. Hooray! Now I can move resonances around as I need without multi cut and solder iterations.

I use solid grey PVC 1/2" square rods to space the dipole ends and a 1/4" thick acrylic sheet 6 x 12" to space the center feed points. These materials are sun resistant and sturdy.

Grant KZ1W


On 5/4/2014 1:56 PM, Jim Lux wrote:
On 5/4/14, 1:46 PM, Tony wrote:
All:

I decided to forgo the ladder line doublet and try a coax-fed fan dipole
for 80, 60, 40 and 30 meters. I have two trees to work with (30 and 50
feet tall) so I can't spread the wires out in different directions. I
figured I'd use PVC or some other lightweight material to spread the wires.

Yes.. pieces of pvc pipe work well as spacers. If you're not looking for 20 year life, then just spray paint pile and call it done. Everything hangs off the longest (80m) wires. you can easily drill a hole through the pipe for the other elements. A nylon zip tie holds the wire from sliding through the hole.
Spray paint when you're all done, so the ziptie gets protected too.


I suspect that the biggest challenge is trying to bring each dipole into
resonance so any suggestions to would be much appreciated. My guess is
that you would start with the 80 meter dipole cut for the lowest portion
of the band and then trim to resonance as you add each dipole.



They interact a lot. Adding incrementally does not work: when you add the new element, it detunes the other ones. If you want a 50 ohm feed point Z, you need a way to raise and lower it easily, because you're going to be doing a lot of crumpling and uncrumpling of the ends of the wires.

I don't know that there's a "good" way to systematically tune it. What I've done is tune each element to approximate resonance in sequence ignoring the interactions (that is, if you tune the short element first, by the time you finish with the long element, the short one is inevitably detuned).

Then, it's sort of an iterative process, and after doing a few changes, you'll get the idea of what shortening or lengthening a given element does to the others.

with 3 wires (the most I've done: 10,20,40(also 15).. the Alpha Delta DX-CC), it took about a dozen up and downs to get them all tuned on all bands.




I predict the process may take some time so it's probably best if I can
borrow an antenna analyzer.

Yes indeed.. that helps to know if you need to go longer or shorter, and how far to go.

If you've got one that can plot the curves, you can see whether the other bands went up or down all at once.



Thanks

Tony
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