Problems persist with "us" because of our very nature.
Anybody reading this hasn't managed to electrocute himself...
We're a deadly mixture of cheapskates and self-proclaimed experts.
Almost any of "us" could make something as seemingly elementary as this
"work"-- that's
what makes us valuable as emergency communicators...
The "problem" exists when we forget, or move, or walk away from some
seemingly "safe"
solution to a problem.
I got lit up pretty good, once upon a time, when I found out the hard
way that some idiot was
using the EMT CONDUIT back to the box as a "neutral".
One of my brothers, a properly educated plumber, saw a big flash when he
cut through a 2"
water line in a building... an abandoned water line by everybody but the
electrician...something
mysteriously killed a bunch of computers in the building at that same
point in time...that's a
pretty fair amount of current going through something only to be used as
a "ground".
Somebody gave me a 1HP pump that I promptly hooked up to an abandoned
well in my yard.
Worked fine for about 2 days, then the long-ago abandoned wire shorted.
No, I did NOT follow my
cheapskate instincts and figure out if the short was between hot and
neutral, or hot and ground,
and just wiggle my way around the issue... I COULD HAVE found some cheap
way around the issue,
but, the hardest thing to troubleshoot is some jackass that took the
easy way out... and I can't be
sure the next guy won't get cooked trying to figure out what I did...
73
Randy
KZ4RV
On 9/14/2014 5:56 AM, Jim Thomson wrote:
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2014 18:26:13 -0700
From: Bill Turner <dezrat@outlook.com>
To: Towertalk <towertalk@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Grounding Multiple Buildings
Message-ID: <BLU436-SMTP128B560C5A6AFC544667360C0CB0@phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
------------ ORIGINAL MESSAGE ------------(may be snipped)
On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 16:22:23 -0700, k9yc wrote:
This afternoon, I pulled out my 2002 copy of NEC and found the section
applicable to what we have been discussing. I suggest that those who
rail at my stupidity and tell me how wrong I am do the same.
REPLY:
Anyone who digs up an obsolete copy of something to prove that he has
the "right" to create a safety hazard has a larger problem than we can
help with here.
73, Bill W6WRT
## Agreed. It baffles me why the code allowed for NO grnd conductor between
building ..
back in 2010..that is fubar. Why the 4 wire code in 2011, when everyone else
had it eons b4.
## here we cant even buy electrical cable that does not include a ground wire.
Its been like that at least as far back as 1960, here in VE7 land.
## In fact, the ground wire is not included in the conductor count in any
cable.
What electricians call 2 wire, consists of 2 conductors...plus a ground.
Whats called 3 wire cable is 3 conductors plus the ground... 4 x wires in all.
## I wonder if 4 wire was cable was available to K9YC back in 2010, when
he installed his 3 wire sub feed ?? If it was, it would have been prudent
to have bought
and used it.
## will the electrical code allow him to install a separate ground wire
between buildings,
then REMOVE the grounded neutral in his sub panel ? That would be the easy
fix.
If not, I would suggest to rip the 3 wire cable out....and do it right this
time...and install
the requisite 4 wire cable. Then the neutral in the sub panel is not
grounded. Then
all fault current flows through the grnd wire...back to the main 200A panel.
## what you need to do is..... upgrade it such that it meets the current 2014
code.
Jim VE7RF
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