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Re: [TowerTalk] 20m stack switching question

To: Jim Thomson <jim.thom@telus.net>, towertalk@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] 20m stack switching question
From: Grant Saviers <grants2@pacbell.net>
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2016 20:19:35 -0700
List-post: <towertalk@contesting.com">mailto:towertalk@contesting.com>
Jim,

I have only a years experience with my 5 over 5 stacks but have observed that the top antenna only can be much quieter at times. I haven't experienced heavy p-static but that is often cited as a reason to select a lower antenna, as is shorter paths. Otherwise I'm in BIP mode except when antennas are in different directions for contests (all are independent on K0XG rings). So, extrapolating that to a 3 high stack rotating tower, I would probably do top only, bottom only, and all.

What I've read agrees that BOP is pretty useless, so I bought stack matches without that capability.

Grant KZ1W


On 7/13/2016 9:27 AM, Jim Thomson wrote:
A buddy has  3 x 20m monobanders, stacked at   172, 117,  62  ft.   Currently, 
all 3 are driven in  phase,
via a L network.  ( 50 ohm to 16.66 ohms, consisting of a   shunt  317.7 pf  
cap  from input  50 ohm connector to chassis, then
a series .2646 uh coil. Coil goes from input connector...to the 3 x paralleled 
output connectors)   Its just a mess of  5 kv NPO  doorknob caps
in parallel + some cu tubing.   Pretty straight forward.   In actuality,  325 
pf was used... and slightly less coil.

The plan was to install some relays, and  then be able to switch top, middle, 
and bottom.... and all 3 in phase.   We can pull that off
with just  3 x  SPST  relays...and  1 x  SPDT relay.

Then we thought, why not be able to use any 2 x yagis at a time, like  top + 
middle... middle + bottom.... and also  top and bottom.
That could be done with a 2nd L network +  1 x additional SPDT relay.

Ok, is it even worth it to be able to use any  2 yagis ??   For  DX, all 3 in 
phase work pretty good.   For local, say within 3000 miles, perhaps
the lowest yagi alone would suffice?     I cant see  the top and bottom buying 
him anything..... vs  all  3 in phase.  I cant see the top and middle
outperforming all  3 in phase.   That only leaves the middle and bottom..and 
even that is dubious... but we have zero experience with this.

Even with the 4 x relays and just one L network box,  we could still easily 
select any 2 yagis..and use the 50: 16.66 ohm L network... however
the swr  will not be dead flat, but it would be <  2: 1      25 / 16.66 =   
1.5:1  swr.... which is still useable.

Are we wasting our time ?   On a side note, the pair of 40m yagis, 180 + 89 
feet, are also driven in phase.... with no provisions  for top + bottom
switching.  However,  BOP  was added to the BIP.   Easily done with a 
switchable  1/2 wave of coax in either leg.  Then countless  hrs spent 
switching between
BIP...and BOP.   BOP was a disaster.  Only once  was BOP a bit louder... and 
that was on 40M during the daytime..and just one station, aprx  200 miles away.
Looking at some notes here and there, it appears that  BOP  has a higher take 
off angle than the lower 40M by itself...which ends up way too high.

Latest plan is to be able to switch  top /bottom /both on the  pair of 40m 
yagis......and ditto with the pair of 15M yagis ( 127  +  79 ft) .  We could 
also add
the BOP function, but after the 40M failed experiment, I think BOP is a total 
write off.

Any thought on any of this  would be greatly appreciated.   BTW, all yagis are 
pointed in the same direction on a rotating tower.   In the original config,
non rotable tower, tic rings were used on 40M + 20m.... then all ants could be 
pointed in different directions.  That came in handy at times, but the tic rings
were a constant head ache.

Jim  VE7RF
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