[CQ-Contest] Self spotting

[Jim Neiger]

Mike, I take exception that "it is virtually identical to what RBN does 
on CW and RTTY".  Perhaps "virtually" is your caveat that they are in 
fact not the same?  With RBN, or packet, etc.  the CQing operator does 
not take a direct and overt action to elicit the spot for assistance.  
His action may, or may not, result in a spot.  From the outset, it was 
not his immediate intent.  All he did was to ID or CQ.

   With "self-spotting", the operator clearly takes an action to "spot" 
oneself.  At a minimum, he is using a means other than a radio signal, 
e.g., computer and the internet, to solicit a QSO. How is that not 
"assisted"?  That so-called genie is now out of the bottle, and with 
deference to your "happier smaller stations", perhaps that will be the 
wave of the future?  Why are these smaller stations happier?  All they 
have to do is tune and listen.  And learn how to copy a call sign.   Ah, 
those crude, pathetic,  good old days......

   Those DX stations on the end of packet spots have already witnessed 
the diminution of operator skills with endless packet and RBN spots: 1) 
the packeteer busts your call and suddenly you are a "new" multiplier to 
many because you're really ZD8Z but now you've been spotted as ZD7Z.  I 
learned years ago that one's only self defense is to QSY to a new 
frequency, and start over with your real ZD8Z call; and 2) RBN pileups 
have the disastrous effect of putting everyone (sometimes many dozens) 
zero beat with one another, and the poor DX operator cannot begin to 
decipher any calls; at least not at any rate, and everyone suffers.  And 
all of these zero beaters don't realize that they're all maybe 559.  
What a mess.  The DX operator then yearns for the sharp ops on the other 
end who've figured this out and QSY off a few HZ, and bingo: his 559 
signal prevails.  Over many years, I've learned that the JA's are very 
gifted at listening and QSYing.    If one does not believe this story, 
do yourself a favor and go somewhere rare (a double mult can be 
educational) this November and show us all how to do it.  A place with 
good propagation to Europe, and Japan, can be most enlightening.

Back to self-spotting:  I believe, that a minimum, those who "need" to 
self spot should be classified as Assisted, or Unlimited, whatever it 
is.  Perhaps that will discourage some, who should know better, that 
they don't have to stoop to that level. There's always hope.

Very 73,

Jim Neiger   N6TJ  ZD8Z etc


On 3/12/2024 8:14 AM, Mike Smith VE9AA wrote:
>   
>
> Henry or anyone confused about what self spotting does or is:
>
> Assisted (or Unlimited) has ALWAYS meant "QSO finding assistance"
>
> ie: some person or technology that tells you Romeo, P5RS7 is on 14.020
> listening up 5
>
> is Assistance.
>
>   
>
> Having a person (including yourself) or a technology TELLING OTHERS that
>
> you, yourself, K4TMC is on 14.222.2 is not assistance.
>
>   
>
> It is virtually identical to what the RBN does on CW and RTTY.
>
>   
>
> It actually levels the playing field (isn't that the goal?) so everyone who
> chooses to use it (when allowed under contest rules)
>
> has the same opportunity to have others find THEM exactly like what take
> place on CW now
>
> whether you all realize it takes place or not.  If you call CQ on CW, the
> RBN will find you.  How can any of you be opposed
>
> to the same thing happening on SSB?
>
>   
>
> Like W0MU I am having a hard time trying to understand why people think this
> is "assistance" or
>
> having any opposition to the "self spot" (unless you really just like CQing
> endlessly on SSB until someone takes pity on you and spots you?)
>
>   
>
> -Mike/VE9AA
>
> p.s.- only ARRL and some QSO parties permit self-spotting.  The sky didn't
> fall and smaller stations are much happier and the playing field is slowly
> but surely getting a little more level.
>
>   
>
> Mike,
>
>   
>
> Re "I still have not figured out who was damaged by this rule change."
>
>   
>
> As someone who operates "unassisted" and claims to be "unassisted" in my
>
> submitted logs, I feel disadvantaged against those "unassisted" who self
>
> spot. As someone else posed a short while back, self spotting is like
>
> having a second radio calling CQ for you while operating radio one, thus a
>
> variation on SO2R. It would be nice to know in the published results which
>
> "unassisted" stations posted a single or more self spot. But then there are
>
> those who would use a different call when spotting themselves...Oh my,
>
> Pandora's box has been opened...the key tossed in the ocean...and the lock
>
> mechanism damaged beyond repair...
>
>   
>
> I know I have been spotted in the past, but I don't know by whom, and I
>
> surely have not asked anyone to spot me.
>
>   
>
> 73,
>
> Henry - K4TMC
>
>   
>
> _______________________________________________
> CQ-Contest mailing list
> CQ-Contest at contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest