[TenTec] Re: About the incivility of our posts

[Richard Detweiler]

>         You need to have a pretty thick skin to post on some of these
>boards.  It doesn't matter whether it is ham radio, fishing or stock
>chatboards.  They are all pretty much the same.  If you voice an opinion
>that appears to be counter to the group thinking, most likely, you are 
>going
>to get flamed, sometimes flamed big time.
>

Agreed with this.

Yuri is good about expressing things the way he sees it.  I can appreciate 
anyone doing so.

Strength though is not always shown in a confrontational way.    There was 
many times that many of us could have backed off but didn't which caused an 
escalation...  I've been caught in that,  lost a tooth in high school over 
it, even I win the fight, it wasn't worth losing the tooth...

Many of these things are like ice cream some like chocolate, some like 
vanilla.  There is no way of convincing the other camp about which is 
better.  Best understand that it is the way it is and leave it at that for 
the subjective likes and dislikes of people.

I think the PTT is a similar issue.  I've heard of at least one contesting 
club move whole heartedly into the Orion, I’ve heard others shy away for 
lack of things important to them.  There is more than one web site for 
contesting that has said a tactic for reducing fatigue is to switch to PTT 
during low activity.  During High activity, the QSK is useful to catch the 
caller that hits just as you start to call CQ.  So this is a little 
different than ice cream, there are points about it both sides.  Does the 
PTT disqualify a rig?  now that's an ice cream choice.

I am not happy with the fact the sweep locks up the CW.  I'd like to use it, 
  Does that disqualify the rig?  Don't know.

I would like to see the send-1,3 keys be user assignable to other functions 
in the menus,  for me I'd like to use the AGC parameters there, then I don't 
have to go to menu...

Best way to improve a product is to unify on a few things at one time that 
really can make a difference.  Then see if it can be done.

For me,  I've worked out the PTT issue on paper,  It will leave the antenna 
relays in TX and mute the audio.  Thus satisfying those that want the 
option.  Give me access to the source code, and things could go faster.

Yuri has a point in that being told it "can't be done" is an arrogant type 
of statement.  It "can be done" if there is a decision to do it.  The next 
question is "is it profitable to do so?”.  That is where we as a user 
community come in.  We can help shape the direction.  Software enhancements 
at this time are probably going to be much more doable than a hardware 
modification.

It is incredibly expensive to design and cut new boards even for the most 
minor of changes.  ( at least in America it is.. )  Yet, as a individuals, 
we are able to come in, and in many cases for less than a buck, make 
modifications as we see best.  I have modified many radios starting with my 
Tempo one.  No reason it can't be improved on...  Why not?  Others may not 
want to do that.  Again back to Ice Cream...

73's
Rich
K5SF


>From: "Bernard" <wtrone at comcast.net>
>Reply-To: tentec at contesting.com
>To: <tentec at contesting.com>
>Subject: Re: [TenTec] Re: About the incivility of our posts
>Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:06:10 -0600
>
>     Yuri:  I appreciate your comments, so let me say this.
>
>         You need to have a pretty thick skin to post on some of these
>boards.  It doesn't matter whether it is ham radio, fishing or stock
>chatboards.  They are all pretty much the same.  If you voice an opinion
>that appears to be counter to the group thinking, most likely, you are 
>going
>to get flamed, sometimes flamed big time.
>
>         When and if this happens, I would strongly suggest that you just 
>let
>it slide.  Getting upset or posting a nasty-o-gram simply does no good.
>
>         Just one man's opinion.
>
>             73
>
>             Bernard, WA4OEJ
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <K3BU at aol.com>
>To: <tentec at contesting.com>
>Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 7:39 PM
>Subject: [TenTec] Re: About the incivility of our posts
>
>
> > In a message dated 2/26/04 1:39:30 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> > w1ael at mindspring.com writes:
> > >>That said, at least a few of us have felt that some of your notes were
> > somewhat ill-tempered (not to mention technically deficient - sorry) and
> > we responded in kind. <<
> >
> > OK, let me elaborate.
> > I am for exchange of ideas, arguments, discussing problems, explaining 
>or
> > learning.
> > What I did, I presented my opinion on receiver sensitivity and need for 
>it
> > going down to 160. Right now at my home QTH I have simple antennas, but 
>I
> > designed and operated my Razor beams (Quad-Yagi see
> > http://members.aol.com/ve3bmv/Razors.htm) and low bands from VE1ZZ QTH. 
>I
>placed in the top spots in the
> > contests. I saw and used the need for maximum sensitivity when using 
>high
> > performance antennas (beaming JA with Razors, the band noise drops to
>ZERO, thanks to
> > sharp pattern and discrimination against noise around). My modified 
>Drake
>R4B
> > is somewhere < 0.1 uV and I needed to crank it up for full sensitivity 
>in
>many
> > situations. I related that as requirement by contesters. Ten-Tec is 
>aiming
> > Orion at contesters. There was a discussion about not needing the
>sensitivity on
> > low bands. I am relating and pointing out that there is a need and rig
>should
> > not be crippled just because "average ham has noise on low bands" using
> > "normal" antennas. Can you point out any other rig that cripples the
>sensitivity on
> > low bands to make it sound "quiet"?
> >
> > Instead of arguing or exploring why do we need sensitivity, you flatly
> > dismiss me and my reasoning. Just like W4PA knows better that we do not
>need PTT
> > line on the mike connector for CW. Instead of just leaving it there, the
>Orion
> > was "improved" in a such way that even Ten-Tec can't bring it back. 
>That's
>where
> > "they know better" comes from. Then the remarks that Orion is not for me
> > (because I am so backward?) I have been creaming world records and
>designed
> > equipment long before Scott got smell of burning transformers.
> >
> > My reference to "TT cult" applies to those who blindly defend 
>shortcomings
> > and problems and attack those who bring the attention to deficiencies 
>and
> > request improvement or provide suggestions. You cultists do not see the
>improvements
> > and better radios as a result of our comments. If you are happy with
>status
> > quo, then fine, but do not push and advertise something for contesters,
>when
> > the contesters tell you what is wrong or what could/should be improved 
>if
>you
> > want us to keep buying TT radios.
> >
> > Are you happy with banging power meter? With "hang time" on the meter? I
>see
> > it is the "feature" - it was "improved", made longer in the first
>published
> > software update. Why in the world do I want the meter to sit there, not
>moving
> > when I am talking or sending CW? I want to see the meter to move as the
>signal
> > is going out, so I can judge the average power, make sure there are no
> > oscillations or too much background noise. Then the power calibration,
>manual says
> > 5%, linear scale on the meter is way off. Takes 5c scale and adjusting 
>the
>meter
> > range to about 130W to avoid banging to the stop. This is not rocket
>science,
> > this is known since first meters were around. Is it worthy $3.6k radio?
>Not
> > in my book. I will bet that meters will be at some point breaking or
>bending
> > their needles, they can only take so much.
> >
> > The point is that world has progressed, if Ten-Tec wants to cater to
>serious
> > operator's market, then they better try to keep up with competition.
>Dollar
> > improvement here and there can make huge difference. Otherwise they will
>be
> > sentenced to the "homebrewy" category - curiosity. That's why TT radios
>were not
> > flooding contester's shacks in past. You wanna keep it as the radio for
>cultist
> > that will praise doesn't matter what? Fine, it is there. You wanna have 
>it
> > truly top notch, contester's prime rig, then lot of stuff should be
>addressed.
> > Personal tirades and ridicules will not achieve that. You will only 
>repel
>those
> > who would be potential customers and want to see the TT radios succeed.
> > Competition doesn't sleep.
> > Internet is a great thing, but sometimes few rotten apples can spoil it
>for
> > others. Why should I argue and take snotty remarks, if I can pick 
>subject,
> > write nice article, (get paid) and let those who appreciate it, enjoy 
>it.
>Those
> > who don't, can skip it.
> >
> > In the past, I was rather selfish, I kept the modification and
>developments
> > to myself, trying to have an edge over others in the contests. It 
>worked,
>my
> > results prove it. Now, when I am trying to help and share some of my
>expertise,
> > I get what I get. I really do not need this, sorry that at the times I
>might
> > seem a bit harsh, but I bite back.
> > This is one more attempt at shedding some light in hope that some people
>will
> > wake up from the cult euphoria. Enjoy whatever turns you on, I mean it
> > generally.
> >
> > You goys want to discuss topics in a civil manner, I am here and I 
>gladly
> > help and share what I know. Many can attest to that in our private
>exchanges. You
> > want to ad hominem remarks, I am outta here.
> >
> > 73 Yuri
> > _______________________________________________
> > TenTec mailing list
> > TenTec at contesting.com
> > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/tentec
>
>
>_______________________________________________
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>TenTec at contesting.com
>http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/tentec

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