[TenTec] omni v short dits
Jim Miller WB5OXQ
wb5oxq at grandecom.net
Sun Jul 25 12:43:59 EDT 2004
I am wondering why anyone is trying to make a radio send cw at speeds that
cannot be coppied by ear by most people? If you just want to send text by
keyboard, use some other digital method that works better.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Hyder -N4NT-" <mike_n4nt at charter.net>
To: <tentec at contesting.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> Hi, Tom--
>
> I've been reading this thread somewhat puzzled. The problem may be
> terminology. Here's what I think these folks are trying to say:
>
> 1. When the key closes, it brings the key line in the rig low.
>
> 2. When the key line goes low, it causes the transmitter to enable itself
to
> be ready to transmit.
>
> 3. At the same time the rig introduces a delay in the key line equal to or
> greater than the time required for Step 2.
>
> 4. After the delay of Step 3, the transmitter is energized to produce RF
> energy.
>
> If it doesn't work pretty much as I've described, I'll join you for a beer
> (and I'm a tee-totaller at present).
>
> 73, Mike N4NT
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tommy" <aldermant at alltel.net>
> To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 11:52 AM
> Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
>
>
> > It must be Sunday because my brain cell just can not tell the difference
> > between increasing the key-on time and decreasing the key-off time, and
> > changing the weight ratio of a character.
> >
> > If you delay the key closure, you are not keying anything, so how does
> that
> > increase something that has not started yet?
> >
> > If you delay the key closure to "decrease the keying-off time", how can
> you
> > decrease the off time of something that has not started?
> >
> > Maybe this is one of those things that are much harder to explain the to
> > actually do? The radio is not going to (obviously) start producing RF
> until
> > the key is closed, so if your delaying the time before you close the
key,
> > the radio is just sitting there staring at you, until you actually close
> the
> > key.
> >
> > I think I need a beer. At least it's something to ponder for the rest of
> the
> > day. Make that two beers!
> >
> > Tom - W4BQF
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Don Watters" <ve1bn at eastlink.ca>
> > To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 9:45 AM
> > Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> >
> >
> > > Steve -
> > >
> > > You asked "How does the rig know it's "make" is being delayed by a
> > keyer?"
> > >
> > > It's the reverse, the key closure is delayed to increase key-on time,
> or
> > > decrease
> > > keying-off time, by the amount of mS you set to match the rig's on
> delay.
> > > The
> > > adjustment is independent of speed and is used to correct keying
> > distortion
> > > of
> > > various transceivers.
> > >
> > > You will note that ARRL tests of key closure versus signal transmit
> delay
> > of
> > > different rigs are shown. I measured the mS needed to compensate my
> > > rigs from those test pix. The Paragon II was "dead on" using the
> Paragon
> > > (1)
> > > test results. Saved a lot of fussin".
> > >
> > > 73 - Don VE1BN at eastlinbk.ca
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Steve N4LQ" <n4lq at iglou.com>
> > > To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> > > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2004 9:17 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Yes sir. I had a K3 Super Duper CMOS here for some time. I sold it
> > because
> > > I
> > > > didn't like the mode B emulation. Other than that, it's ok.
Listening
> to
> > > the
> > > > weight vs. "keying compensation" adjustment in another receiver,
they
> > > seem
> > > > to do exactly the same thing which is to increase the length of the
> > > > characters. The only difference is that the "keying compensation"
> > doesn't
> > > > affect the K3's racus sidetone.
> > > > Now I have a question about one of your statements.
> > > >
> > > > "Keying compensation allows the make to be delayed so that the
start
> of
> > > the
> > > > > rig's
> > > > > keying envelope matches the keyer. The weight control is
> different."
> > > >
> > > > How does the rig know it's "make" is being delayed by a keyer?
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, for some rigs, especially ICOMS, when used in QSK mode,
extra
> > > weight
> > > > is needed. When I use my MFJ 407 with the PROII in QSK mode, I
simply
> > > crank
> > > > up the weight control about 30%. In Semi-bkin mode, I turn it back
to
> > > > normal. The sidetone in the PROII reflects this change and sounds
> rather
> > > > heavy. When using the K3 keyer, you get the same exact effect when
> > > > increasing either the "weight" or "compensation". If you can stand
to
> > > listen
> > > > to the sick duck sidetone of the K3, the weight of the sidetone is
> > > preserved
> > > > by increasing the "compensation" instead of the "weight". So
basically
> > the
> > > > "compensation" adjustment is a gimmick.
> > > > Most TenTec rigs do not seem to require additional weight but las
Tom
> > > > mentioned, the Omni 6+ does need a little help over about 45 WPM.
The
> > > Orion
> > > > seems to be rather unpredictable in this reguard. Mine was choppy at
> > first
> > > > then I upgraded the software and it sounded much better but my QSK
> > became
> > > > slow. Maybe there's a relation!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Steve N4LQ
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Don Watters" <ve1bn at eastlink.ca>
> > > > To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> > > > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2004 7:45 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Whatever, Steve. Please don't take me for a fool. Guess I am
just
> a
> > > > lucky
> > > > > fellow
> > > > > with a CMOS Superkeyer 3 which can compensate keying in various
> rigs.
> > > > Ever
> > > > > try one? Was a cmcl op, used a bug for 40 years from early ham
> days
> > in
> > > > > 1946
> > > > > until I sold my little Zephyr 5 years ago. I've used the CMOS for
> the
> > > past
> > > > > 9.
> > > > >
> > > > > Guess I'm a true blue CW op too!! I know you don't tighten the
> > dits
> > > up
> > > > > on a bug
> > > > > as close as suggested.
> > > > >
> > > > > Keying compensation allows the make to be delayed so that the
start
> of
> > > the
> > > > > rig's
> > > > > keying envelope matches the keyer. The weight control is
> different.
> > > It
> > > > > shortens
> > > > > the spacing of characters, sort of runs them together if too much
> > weight
> > > > is
> > > > > set. Big
> > > > > difference. These are heard in the Ten-Tec sidetones.
> > > > >
> > > > > Was just suggesting a possible solution, but forget it OM, you
> > > apparently
> > > > > already
> > > > > have the answers....
> > > > >
> > > > > By the way, no offence taken or meant.
> > > > >
> > > > > 73 - Don VE1BN at eastlink.com
> > > > >
> > > > > Gosh. just seems to do the job. ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Steve N4LQ" <n4lq at iglou.com>
> > > > > To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2004 8:06 PM
> > > > > Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Keying compensation? Delay? Sounds like a line from the K3
manual.
> I
> > > > > suppose
> > > > > > if he had a keyer he could crank up the weight but I'm not
sure
> > the
> > > > ole
> > > > > > boy owns one. He's a true, blue cw op! Bug only! BTW: That
"keying
> > > > > > compensation" is just another weight control. The only
difference
> in
> > > > that
> > > > > > and a regular weight control on a Curtis keyer is the fact that
it
> > > > doesn't
> > > > > > affect the sidetone (which few people use anyway).
> > > > > > Steve N4LQ
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Don Watters" <ve1bn at eastlink.ca>
> > > > > > To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> > > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2004 6:19 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hi Steve -
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Any way he can set the keying compensation? I found my
Paragon
> > II
> > > > > needed
> > > > > > > about 15 mS delay to give a smooth keying characteristic. No
> > > shortened
> > > > > > makes
> > > > > > > or clicks. Worth a try if he can set it up.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 73 - Don, VE1BN at eastlink.ca
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: "Steve N4LQ" <n4lq at iglou.com>
> > > > > > > To: <tentec at contesting.com>
> > > > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2004 6:30 PM
> > > > > > > Subject: [TenTec] omni v short dits
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > A friend of mine has an Omni V and he is trying to use a bug
> > however
> > > > the
> > > > > > > dits are being chopped so badly that he can't use it. I've
never
> > had
> > > a
> > > > > > > TenTec rig that chopped dits like this one. I've hear him on
the
> > air
> > > > and
> > > > > > > even with his dit weight screwed to almost touching, he sounds
> > > > horrible.
> > > > > > > It's like something is wrong in the keying circuit. Has anyone
> > > > > experienced
> > > > > > > this?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Steve N4LQ
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > TenTec mailing list
> > > > > > > TenTec at contesting.com
> > > > > > > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/tentec
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
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> > > > >
> > > > >
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