[TOEC] Fw: Vad är detta?

Göran Ingemar Backman sm5sic at gmail.com
Sun Feb 7 21:05:19 EST 2016 

Dear Mats,

Nice to hear from You. God fortsättning på det nya året.

Yes, You are right; I might have misunderstood the settings

"/S och /SA - vad är det för konstiga hemsnickrade tillägg?

OH1BGG/SA blir ju SM, Sverige i alla loggprogram och SA0 som prefix.

Inget som PTS ligger bakom i alla fall."

which in my eyes looked disrespectful.

However, if there would be any comments on the CTY files, maybe an e-mail
to AD1C Jim would be a good idea. Is it not Jim, that is taking care of the
updating of the CTY files? And I agree with You Mats, that we will show
respect to other countries, when they use special call signs to commemorate
historic events. And for a contester it is good in for instance WPX, when
there are special prefixes, because that is a new multiplier, hihi.


73 de SM5SIC/OH1SIC Göran




2016-02-07 16:39 GMT+00:00 Mats Strandberg <sm6lrr at gmail.com>:

> Göran,
>
> I think you maybe misunderstood some of us...
>
> The issue is not whether the special calls or dates are important or not.
> They for sure have all our respect and we like the activities as such, but
> what we questioned was to include them in CTY files or not, as those calls
> are not really active in the contests.
>
> There are many contesters that both share the interest for special calls,
> special activitites and contest. But not always those activities are
> related to contest itself - so the comment on CTY and contest programs are
> for sure relevant in my view at least.
>
> So, just to clarify - a contester might be a person that only cares about
> CTY files and contesting, but in many cases, a contester is like any other
> human being, namely interested and curious in many diverse interests.
>
> So no contradiction in that, and for sure no disprespect towards Oman,
> Finland and any other countries that choose to use special prefixes to
> commemorate historic events.
>
> 73 de Mats RM2D
>
>
>
> 2016-02-06 16:04 GMT+03:00 Göran Ingemar Backman <sm5sic at gmail.com>:
>
>> Anybody that has been listening to the band during the last years, has
>> been able to notice the increase of special call signs and different
>> suffixes. For instance Oman and Bahrain had special call signs last years
>> when they celebrated 45 years as independent countries. I operated
>> A41OO/45, please see QRZ.com.
>>
>> The discussion above reflects what is really important for certain
>> people.
>>
>> If You live in Oman, it was really important when the country turned 45
>> years and therefore every ham in A4 could use the suffix /45 in their call
>> sign during November 2015.
>>
>> If You know about Finland, You will understand how serious the situation
>> was there 1939-1940, 1941-1944 and 1944-1945 (I am referring to the three
>> wars that Finland had during WWII, where most Swedes do not even know that
>> Finland was in three wars, not two). All families except for the immigrants
>> have older relatives that either died, were wounded or got their minds
>> seriously messed up during these wars. These are importants events in
>> Finnish history because the freedom of the country had to be paid with a
>> heavy toll. Therefore Indepence day in Finland on 6 Dec is a serious day,
>> not a carneval. Therefore the veterans are remembered even after their
>> death by a special sign on their tomb stones. Therefore using old military
>> radio equipment on 40m and 80m during Independece day 6 Dec and
>> during Field Marshal Mannerheim day 4 June  with the suffixes /SA and /S is
>> something with meaning to the people of Finland.
>>
>> But if You are only interested in N1MM and CTY files, then the most
>> important thing will be to get Your program to run without problems. Your
>> whole world is focused on a contest software and its files. It makes sence
>> to me, but I feel sorry for these poor soles, that are mentally deprived
>> from the rest of the world. After all, there are more important things than
>> computer programs and country files
>>
>>
>> 73 de SM5SIC/OH1SIC Göran
>>
>>
>> 2016-02-05 13:23 GMT+00:00 Jan-Eric Rehn <jan-eric.rehn at telia.com>:
>>
>>> Hi Jari,
>>>
>>> Thanks for the info.
>>>
>>> I also tried to add some calls into N1MM+ and DX4WIN. Both programs
>>> updated with fresh CTY.dat today.
>>>
>>> N1MM+ ver.1.0.5458.0 (Contest log program):
>>>
>>> OH2BU/S = Unknown country
>>> OH2BU/SA = Sweden
>>> S/OH2BU = Unknown country
>>> SA/OH2BU = Sweden
>>>
>>> OH1BGG/S = Unknown country
>>> OH1BGG/SA = Sweden
>>> S/OH1BGG = Unknown country
>>> SA/OH1BGG = Sweden
>>>
>>> DX4WIN ver. 8.05 (Ordinary log program):
>>>
>>> OH2BU/S = Unknown country
>>> OH2BU/SA = Sweden
>>> S/OH2BU = Unknown country
>>> SA/OH2BU = Sweden
>>>
>>> OH1BGG/S = Finland
>>> OH1BGG/SA = Finland
>>> S/OH1BGG = Unknown country
>>> SA/OH1BGG = Sweden
>>>
>>>
>>> OH2BU was not amongst the calls in "Retired Callsigns/prefixes:", but
>>> OH1BGG was. As the calls under that heading was erased from the new CTY.dat
>>> the results in N1MM+ was as expected.
>>>
>>> The "long" version of CTY.dat is used in "ordinary" log programs, such
>>> as DX4WIN and OH1BGG/SA is still there. Therefore the results in DX4WIN is
>>> also as expected.
>>>
>>> But - I still think there are trouble with such additions to a callsign,
>>> especially with the use of all the different log programs in the computer.
>>> N1MM+ and DX4WIN are only two of all log programs and all the others don't
>>> act the same way.
>>>
>>> That means that calls with the endings /QRP, /QRPP, /QRO, /MM, /AM, /P,
>>> /M, /LH, /SA, /S, /60 etc ... needs to be in the "long" CTY.dat to be shown
>>> as the correct country (if the log program isn't having some of those
>>> endings approved).
>>>
>>> If more countries will do the same as Finland - how big will that "long"
>>> CTY.dat be???
>>>
>>> Another thing:
>>>
>>> You wrote:
>>> In fact, as you can use any number after your call, you can choose a
>>> good number for eg. WPX-contest. I could use OH2BU/4 from my OH2 QTH and
>>> have a bigger pile-up.
>>>
>>> My question is: Can you use OH2BU/0 and then claim you are on OH0???
>>> Maybe you can in WPX contest, but what if you use OH2BU/0 in SAC? Then
>>> you're definitely in/on OH0...
>>>
>>> In that case I think we need new rules in SAC.
>>>
>>> 73 de Jan, SM3CER
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- From: Jari Jussila
>>> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 9:49 AM
>>> To: Mats Strandberg
>>> Cc: Rune Wande ; TOEC
>>> Subject: Re: [TOEC] Fw: Vad är detta?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mats et al.
>>>
>>> Thanks for good comments!
>>>
>>> You're right, I forgot the Canadian example.They have been protesting
>>> about it for years.
>>>
>>> 1) Finland does not have (official) districts any more, so when you come
>>> here with your CEPT-license, you have to use OH/RM2D or OH0/RM2D. You
>>> can tell your QTH by adding the (old) district after your call as
>>> OH/RM2D/2 or OH/RM2D/OH2. But, let say, if you use OH2/RM2D I don't
>>> think nobody is to protest ....
>>>
>>> In fact, as you can use any number after your call, you can choose a
>>> good number for eg. WPX-contest. I could use OH2BU/4 from my OH2 QTH and
>>> have a bigger pile-up.
>>>
>>> 2) From authorities point of view, they are interesting only in the
>>> letters an numbers before "/". Whatever comes after "/" is unofficial
>>> and a amateur insider thing, being /QRP, /QRPP, /QRO, /MM, /AM, /P, /M,
>>> /LH, /SA, /S, /60 etc ....
>>>
>>> 3) Yes .... when I write OH2BU/SA in N1MM+, it gives Sweden as my
>>> country.
>>>
>>> Jari, OH2BU
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 5.2.2016 10:20, Mats Strandberg wrote:
>>>
>>>> I also had this Canadian example in mind because I worked VE7AHA/KH6 on
>>>> 40
>>>> meters in 2013 or 2014. However, the same VE7AHA is now active from
>>>> Hawaii
>>>> as KH6/VE7AHA, so maybe they changed.
>>>>
>>>> See you both in a week :)
>>>>
>>>> 73 de Mats RM2D
>>>>
>>>> PS  I realized that my note about RA/SM5XYZ needs to be clarified a
>>>> little.
>>>> What I meant to say is that the same RA/SM5XYZ must be used for work in
>>>> all
>>>> Russia, and the consequence is that you can work from three different
>>>> DXCC-countries with the same call...  Even 4 if the person gets permit
>>>> for
>>>> Franz Jozef Land (which I doubt) as this is an area that requires
>>>> additional permit apart from the visa to visit.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Den 5 februari 2016 11:06 skrev Rune Wande<rune.wande at bahnhof.se>:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Terve Jari!
>>>>> As far as I know, Canadians working from the USA are to be using their
>>>>> call like this example: VE8RCS/W6.
>>>>> Also as far as I know I am not "allowed" to use W5/SM5COP as I have a
>>>>> USA
>>>>> call of my own! I am supposed
>>>>> to be using my US call. But that has nothing to do with this
>>>>> dicussion, Hi!
>>>>> See you at the CCF meeting!
>>>>> 73 de Rune SM5COP
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Den 2016-02-05 kl. 01:48, skrev Jari Jussila:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Mats, Janne, Ingemar etc ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My good friend Ben, OH6PA; gave you a good explanation on what these
>>>>>> OH#xx/S and /SA stations are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But to have a broaded perpective, we should remember that nowadays the
>>>>>> prefix of the country you visit, is not given after your own call but
>>>>>> before it. Eg, when I come to Sweden, I'm SM/OH2BU etc.
>>>>>> Or ... if you come to Finland, it will be OH/SM5AJV.  I guess it's
>>>>>> only
>>>>>> one country in the world which use the old system having it's prefix
>>>>>> after
>>>>>> the visiting call sign, That is Bermuda, still giving the call sign as
>>>>>> OH2BU/VP9.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All contest programs should understand the new way of having the
>>>>>> visiting
>>>>>> countries prefix before the call sign and thus understanding, that
>>>>>> whatever
>>>>>> comes after the call sign after the "/" is not valid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And to go a bit further to the Finnish licensing  ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In Finland it's not compulsory to use /M, /MM, /AM, or /P. You can use
>>>>>> them if you like. In fact, in Finland I can have whatever I want
>>>>>> after the
>>>>>> "/" in the end of my call sign. I can use from my QTH here close to
>>>>>> Helsinki OH2BU/SM or OH2BU/P5 or - as Ben wrote, OH2BU/60 if I some
>>>>>> day
>>>>>> have that anniversary. If it's wise to use OH2BU/P5 is another thing
>>>>>> ....
>>>>>> but it surely would be legal ..... Whick remains me, that when I back
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> early 1990's was on Malyj Vysotskij (R1MV), we had to use the call
>>>>>> sign
>>>>>> given by the Russian PTT - it was OH2BU/MVI written in the license.
>>>>>> It was
>>>>>> more that twenty G-stations, who said that we are pirates, because /M
>>>>>> would
>>>>>> be England ....
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Finska "Amatörradioföreskrift" säger så här: "Förutom vad som
>>>>>> fastställts
>>>>>> om anropssignalen i 1–4 mom. får efter anropssignalen också fogas ett
>>>>>> tilläggstecken eller en teckenserie, avskild med ett snedstreck."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jari, OH2BU
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 4.2.2016 22:31, Jan-Eric Rehn wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hej Ben!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tack för svaret och förklaringen.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Oavsett om det är tillåtet att ha dessa tillägg i Finland, så blir
>>>>>>> det
>>>>>>> väldigt problematiskt för alla loggprogram. XXXXX/SA blir ju SM,
>>>>>>> Sverige
>>>>>>> som land och för prefixjägare blir det SA0 som prefix. Vad /S blir i
>>>>>>> loggprogrammen vet jag inte - kanske okänt land. Strul blir det i
>>>>>>> vilket
>>>>>>> fall som helst. Och att det sedan förekommer en svensk signal med
>>>>>>> samma
>>>>>>> tillägg är ännu underligare (SM6AAL/S). I Sverige är ju inte ett
>>>>>>> sådant
>>>>>>> call tillåtet.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vad jag känner till, så är det bara ett fåtal tillägg man kan göra
>>>>>>> efter
>>>>>>> ett call - /AM, /M, /MM och /P och kanske något/några till och vilka
>>>>>>> de
>>>>>>> flesta loggprogram förstår. T.ex. är ju inte /QRP ett godkänt
>>>>>>> tillägg efter
>>>>>>> ett call, även om många använder det. Jag tror det t.o.m. finns någon
>>>>>>> contest som har i sina regler, att dom som kör QRP ska använda /QRP
>>>>>>> efter
>>>>>>> callet. Inte bra. Jag hörde också i REF Contest flera franska
>>>>>>> stationer som
>>>>>>> använde nummerbeteckningarna på sina "departments" efter sina call,
>>>>>>> t.ex.
>>>>>>> F5XXX/24. Inte heller bra.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nåja, callen stod under rubriken "Retired Callsigns/prefixes:", så
>>>>>>> det
>>>>>>> innebär väl, att de fanns med i några tidigare cty.dat, men att de
>>>>>>> nu tas
>>>>>>> bort igen.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 73 de Janne, SM3CER
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hej Janne
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jaha du undrar varför man har tillägg till suffix  förstår jag
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jo det är så att 2 gånger i året hålls en antikradio aktivitet
>>>>>>> Den största och viktigaste går av stapeln vid Finlands
>>>>>>> självständighetsdag
>>>>>>> den 6 december
>>>>>>> Den andra är Finlands armés flaggdag då det hålles många parader
>>>>>>> Den infaller på Marsalk Mannerheims födelsedag den 4 Juni
>>>>>>> Aktiviteten begränsad till 80m och 40m
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Aktiviteten med radio består i att man aktiverar gamla militär
>>>>>>> radiostationer
>>>>>>> Som man restaurerat.
>>>>>>> först kör man CW sedan AM
>>>>>>> Nu lommer jag it tillägget i suffixet
>>>>>>> Enligt telekonventionen får man göra tilläg till SUFFIXET tex om man
>>>>>>> fyller
>>>>>>> 50 år så sätt dit /50
>>>>>>> Första två teckknen i en anrops signal hänvisar till i vilket land
>>>>>>> stationen
>>>>>>> befinner sig och det är obligatoriskt
>>>>>>> Sen till det som förbryllar dig förstår jag (Jag har påpekat detta
>>>>>>> till
>>>>>>> traditionsradisterna att det finns frågor om detta)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> /SA = Suomen Armeija (Finska Armén)
>>>>>>> De stationer som har det tillägget använder stationer som har
>>>>>>> använts i
>>>>>>> WWII
>>>>>>> icke enbart finsktillverkade
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> /S = Sotilas = Soldat Det tillägget användes av stationer som
>>>>>>> använts av
>>>>>>> någon armé
>>>>>>> ( Jag kör OI6SP/S med Ra200 alltså = /S Kör jag med 2W-Br/40 =/SA )
>>>>>>> Stationer som har tillägg efter anrops signalen måste ha en armé
>>>>>>> station
>>>>>>> som
>>>>>>> är minst 30 år gammal
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Alltså detta /SA har inget att göra med svenska PREFIXE SA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hälsa Rune
>>>>>>> Och fins det flera frågor fins jag på Radiomässan i Eskilstuna 2
>>>>>>> aprill
>>>>>>> Får gärna förklaras i QTC angående Prefix och Suffix
>>>>>>> Mailet med svar får du gärna sätt ut i TOEC spridningen
>>>>>>> Aktiviteten är ingen tävling
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 73's de Ben OH6PA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan-Eric Rehn"<
>>>>>>> jan-eric.rehn at telia.com>
>>>>>>> To:<oh6pa at sral.fi>
>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 7:29 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Fw: [TOEC] Vad är detta?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hej Ben!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vet du vad detta är???
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 73 de Janne, SM3CER
>>>>>>>> SSA HF Contest Manager
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- From: Rune Wande
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 6:13 PM
>>>>>>>> To: toec at contesting.com ; Jan-Eric rehn
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [TOEC] Vad är detta?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> En som säkert vet är OH6PA.
>>>>>>>> Han går nog att nå lätt och på svenska.
>>>>>>>> 73 de Rune SM5COP
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Den 2016-02-04 kl. 18:09, skrev Jan-Eric Rehn:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hej Mats!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Nej, jag har inte skrivit till “dem”. Vilka dem menar du att jag
>>>>>>>>> skulle
>>>>>>>>> ha skrivit till?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 73 de Janne, SM3CER
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Mats Strandberg
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 5:59 PM
>>>>>>>>> To: Jan-Eric Rehn
>>>>>>>>> Cc: TOEC
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [TOEC] Vad är detta?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Synnerligen märkligt...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 73 de Mats LRR
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> PS  Antar att du skrivit till dem?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Den 4 februari 2016 19:55 skrev Jan-Eric Rehn<
>>>>>>>>> jan-eric.rehn at telia.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>     Hej!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     CTY-2602 Country Files - 04 February 2016 har kommit idag.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     Där hittar jag följande info:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     * OH1BGG/SA, OH1FJ/S, OH1SJ/S, OH1TX/SA, OH2BMB/SA, OH2BNX/SA,
>>>>>>>>> OH2MEE/SA,
>>>>>>>>>     OH2NAS/SA, OH2ZY/S, OH3FJQ/SA, OH3HB/S, OH3HHO/SA, OH3KRB/S,
>>>>>>>>> OH3MY/S,
>>>>>>>>> OH6FA/SA,
>>>>>>>>>     OH6FSQ/S, OH6K/S, OH6QR/SA, OH9AR/S, OI3V/S, OI3V/SA, OI6SP/S
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> OI7AX/S
>>>>>>>>>     in Finland, OH
>>>>>>>>>     * SM6AAL/S in Sweden, SM
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     /S och /SA - vad är det för konstiga hemsnickrade tillägg?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     OH1BGG/SA blir ju SM, Sverige i alla loggprogram och SA0 som
>>>>>>>>> prefix.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     Inget som PTS ligger bakom i alla fall.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     73 de Janne, SM3CER
>>>>>>>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>     TOEC mailing list
>>>>>>>>>     TOEC at contesting.com
>>>>>>>>>     http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/toec
>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
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