Topband: Topband Digest, Vol 109, Issue 36

Sat Jan 21 07:12:04 PST 2012

George,
    Well written and true.
                 73 Doug EI2CN

-----Original Message-----
From: topband-bounces at contesting.com [mailto:topband-bounces at contesting.com]
On Behalf Of topband-request at contesting.com
Sent: 21 January 2012 14:50
To: topband at contesting.com
Subject: Topband Digest, Vol 109, Issue 36

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Ticked over intentional interference on top band (Eddy Swynar)
   2. Re: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
      (Mike & Coreen Smith)
   3. Re: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
      (Joel Harrison)
   4. Re: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
      (GeorgeWallner)
   5. Interference on 160 (John Harden)
   6. Re: metal enclosure (Roy)
   7. Re: Interference on 160 (Doug Renwick)
   8. Re: My First DX (Chet)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:07:39 -0500
From: Eddy Swynar <deswynar at xplornet.ca>
Subject: Re: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
To: Roger D Johnson <n1rj at roadrunner.com>
Cc: topband at contesting.com
Message-ID: <FD60CABD-08E8-46E7-B978-C1907B5DE3F1 at xplornet.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

On 2012-01-21, at 6:32 AM, Roger D Johnson wrote:

> Unfortunately, VE1ZZ has a terrible signal with key clicks out to over1kHz
> from his carrier frequency. Perhaps the other chap had a signal he was
> trying to copy wiped out by ZZ and decided to get even.

Hi Roger,

Sez who...?

Jack's keying may well be a tad on the hard side, but his signal HARDLY
emits "...key clicks out to over 1 KHz from his carrier frequency",
IMHO...and I've copied him at some 30 db.+ over S-9 here, too, so if he was,
indeed, "clicky", I think I'd know...

There seems to be a clique of anal "Kilocycle Klix Kops" on 160-meters that
is obsessed with key clicks, & is quick to condemn---much too quick to
condemn, IMHO---guys like Jack. Far be it for me to suggest that you're a
part of that "elite" group, Roger, but I know from personal experience that
"...perception is reality", and if so-called tribal knowledge on the band
has it that Jack is guilty, then he's been effectively branded as such for
life. 

It's not fair, & it's not becoming of anyone who aspires to be one in a
league of gentlemen to criticize one's fellows in a medium to which said
fellow may not be a party of, and thus unable to defend himself...I know:
I've been there myself personally, and I did NOT like it.

~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 09:18:03 -0400
From: "Mike & Coreen Smith" <ve9aa at nbnet.nb.ca>
Subject: Re: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
Cc: <topband at contesting.com>
Message-ID: <00d801ccd83f$1b5c8810$6501a8c0 at II>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

There is hardly a station closer to Jack on 160m than me. ( a couple 
VE1's/VY2's maybe) and yes, I'll be one of the first to admit his keying is 
indeed a bit "hard", but I wouldn't say he's especially wide.  He's about 
60/9 here, but I have never thought he was QRMing me by his keying.  (if 
anything, just brute signal strength probably more than anything)

I've heard much worse coming out of other parts of Eastern NA with stations 
that are much weaker and take out "segments" of the band with horrendous key

clicks or problems with their amplifiers.

VE9AA

Mike, Coreen & Corey Smith
699 Rte 616 Keswick Ridge
NB
Canada
E6L 1T1
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Eddy Swynar
  To: Roger D Johnson
  Cc: topband at contesting.com
  Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 9:07 AM
  Subject: Re: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band

  On 2012-01-21, at 6:32 AM, Roger D Johnson wrote:

  > Unfortunately, VE1ZZ has a terrible signal with key clicks out to 
over1kHz
  > from his carrier frequency. Perhaps the other chap had a signal he was
  > trying to copy wiped out by ZZ and decided to get even.

  Hi Roger,

  Sez who...?

  Jack's keying may well be a tad on the hard side, but his signal HARDLY 
emits "...key clicks out to over 1 KHz from his carrier frequency", 
IMHO...and I've copied him at some 30 db.+ over S-9 here, too, so if he was,

indeed, "clicky", I think I'd know...

  There seems to be a clique of anal "Kilocycle Klix Kops" on 160-meters 
that is obsessed with key clicks, & is quick to condemn---much too quick to 
condemn, IMHO---guys like Jack. Far be it for me to suggest that you're a 
part of that "elite" group, Roger, but I know from personal experience that 
"...perception is reality", and if so-called tribal knowledge on the band 
has it that Jack is guilty, then he's been effectively branded as such for 
life.

  It's not fair, & it's not becoming of anyone who aspires to be one in a 
league of gentlemen to criticize one's fellows in a medium to which said 
fellow may not be a party of, and thus unable to defend himself...I know: 
I've been there myself personally, and I did NOT like it.

  ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ
  _______________________________________________
  UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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19:34:00

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 07:21:28 -0600
From: Joel Harrison <w5zn at w5zn.org>
Subject: Re: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
To: topband at contesting.com
Message-ID:
	<CAD6g-fveTR6NAm+b2qmWfWjV3mD77_NwDzeZ2J_zKyBXLDC__Q at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Mike,

I'm not a psychologist but after 40 years as an active radio amateur, 27 of
which were directly involved in national and international amateur radio
organizations, I learned that once a person enters the solitude of a dark
corner of a room in their home Dr. Jekyll turns into Mr. Hyde with a radio
and keyboard in front of him with access to the world, especially
if anonymity is available. They're different people in public (well, most
of them!)

I don't understand it, I don't like it, and it is sad but sometimes just
walking away for bit and taking a breath is the best response.

73 Joel W5ZN

On Sat, Jan 21, 2012 at 6:45 AM, Mike & Coreen Smith
<ve9aa at nbnet.nb.ca>wrote:

> By the way, a weird thing happened to me the other week. (rare for 160m
> that
> is)
>
> Well, not so weird, as maybe insulting.....I was working a bunch of Europe
> on 160m, spotting them as I went up and down the band.  I ended up calling
> TA3D a bunch of times @ his sunrise and never made it.  Eventually he
QRT'd
> and I got called on TA3D's ex-frequency by a UA4 somebody who I later
found
> out was running 100w and he was happy for his first Canada on
> 160m.....anyways, a very small pileup started with LY, YL, UA4's, OH, SM's
> etc. calling me after TA3D had left.
>
> Some guy kept QRMing me with the dit-machine....we've all had it happen to
> us....anyways, this guy eventually kept asking me if I was a LID and
> spotting my own pileup or something like that.  QSB and QRN took him out a
> bit at times.  At first I thought he was asking me to QSY, but he
> definately
> was asking if I was a LID, and something about spotting.  I was so PO'd
> (like red in the face upset) I stopped the mini pileup, and turned the rig
> off.  (If you are reading this, you won !)
>
> Figured I just didn't need the aggravation.  It's not too often I get
upset
> about ham radio. In fact it's very very rare.  It's a hobby I derive great
> enjoyment out of.  I could miss a rare chance at a JA on 6m and I wouldn't
> get "upset", ya know?  I could lose an all weekend contest by 1000 pts and
> still not get upset.  I could wait in a pileup for an hour and not be
> upset.
> But this....  This just rubbed me the wrong way.
>
> I don't know what problem folks have about DX spotting.  By the way, I
> never
> spotted myself, nor any of the DX I was working once I had the old TA3D
> freq....only before, as I was gg up and down the band.  There were almost
> no
> spots coming out of NA at the time, even though 160 was in fine shape.
>  Only
> heard a few guys on from NA and propagation was very very good at the
time.
> Even had a K7...think it was K7ZV thank me on the Lowband ON4KST chat site
> thank me for the spots and he had nabbed a couple new ones off my spots.
> Kinda makes me feel good, but the terrible words from the unknown guy made
> me feel like I should take up stamp collecting.  Less aggravation !
>
>
> VE9AA
> Mike, Coreen & Corey Smith
> 699 Rte 616 Keswick Ridge
> NB
> Canada
> E6L 1T1
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: Larry
>  To: topband at contesting.com
>  Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 11:42 PM
>  Subject: Re: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
>
>
>  Unfortunately 160 is not immune to that kind of behavior. I have run into
>  it before (including from an A1 Op member). Some would argue they were
>  agressively pursuing a DX QSO. Most of us would classify the operation
>  as just plain QRM.
>
>  73, Larry  W6NWS
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: <wa3mej at comcast.net>
>  To: <topband at contesting.com>
>  Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 10:01 PM
>  Subject: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
>
>
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > I have been a ham for almost 46 years now and having been on 160 off an
> on
>  > for much of that time. Tonight I saw something that I had not really
> seen
>  > on 160 and kinda ticked me off big time; some idiot intentiionally
> trying
>  > to jam VE1ZZ while he was trying to work a DX station that I didnt even
>  > hear (I'M Jealous obviously). This kind of thing happens a lot on 80
> what
>  > with all the idiots directly challenging the FCC and all but I have not
>  > really run into it on the gentlemens band. Everyone is for the most
part
>  > so pleasant on this band. I mean if why not just turn it into a contest
>  > for who can work the station first? but to intentionally be a spoiler
> for
>  > another station just doesnt cut it.
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > It would be nice to find this joker and poke pins in his coax. Whats
the
>  > saying " I'm mad as hell and not going to put up with this" ???
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Jim WA3MEJ
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > P.S. VE1ZZ hope you got the contact anyhow.
>  > _______________________________________________
>  > UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK
>
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
>
>
>
>  No virus found in this incoming message.
>  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>  Version: 8.5.454 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/4154 - Release Date: 01/19/12
> 19:34:00
> _______________________________________________
> UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK
>

-- 
73 Joel W5ZN

www.w5zn.org

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:53:24 -0500
From: "GeorgeWallner" <aa7jv at atlanticbb.net>
Subject: Re: Topband: Ticked over intentional interference on top band
To: topband at contesting.com
Message-ID: <web-3406308 at be3.cluster1.echolabs.net>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8; format="flowed"

On Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:07:39 -0500
  Eddy Swynar <deswynar at xplornet.ca> wrote:

>> Unfortunately, VE1ZZ has a terrible signal with key 
>>clicks out to over1kHz
> Hi Roger,
> 
> Sez who...?
> 
> Jack's keying may well be a tad on the hard side, but 
>his signal HARDLY emits "...key clicks out to over 1 KHz 
>
G'day Gentlemen,

I don't think it is "branding" when pointing out a problem 
with someone's signal. It happens to all of us and we need 
to know when our signal is not right.

N4IS called me once that I had two weak spurs about 3 kHz 
from my carrier. I could not detect them at all on my 
second RX, or see them on my spectrum analyzer. We started 
troubleshooting and soon found the problem: two burned out 
resistors in the K3's PA. (Resistors in the feedback loop 
can burn out and cuase the bias circuit to oscillate -- K3 
owners please be aware!)

Another time, I was really insenced at this strong station 
with very storng clicky signals, just to find out that I 
did not have my AGC set correctly and the clix were 
generated in my own RX! Ooops! Good that I checked first 
before making a comment.

I have also heard, however, during a contest, a station 
with strong clicks he normally did not have. Deliberate? 
Perhaps to keep "his" running frequency clean?
Perhaps he has just turned his drive a tad too high in the 
excitement. Pointing the clix out to him should not hurt 
his feelings, I recon.

We get all kinds of reasons for poor signals and the 
sooner we let each other know the better. The band is a 
precious and limited resource, we need to keep it clean. I 
sure will not be upset if somebody lets me know!

Of course, intentional jamming, that is an entirely 
different subject, but...

73,

George, AA7JV

------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 09:04:49 -0500
From: John Harden <jhdmd at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Topband: Interference on 160
To: topband at contesting.com
Message-ID: <4F1AC601.9060004 at bellsouth.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

It has been my pleasure to have been a ham and DXer since 1959 at age 
15. There was a lot of howling going on even back then. Once Buck Joyner 
(SK about 1970) was on AM. Someone told him he was "wide". He came back 
laughingly and said "I'm not wide, ...I'm just loud!" He had the biggest 
signal in Atlanta.

Many times people forget to put their VFO's on split, or they do not 
hear the DX station well due to QSB, QRM or whatever. I would say that 
the vast majority of DXers do not do anything intentionally in the heat 
of battle.... This is just a hobby and I do not think that we need any 
policemen.

Nobody listens to them anyway. The ones that get upset are usually the 
ones that do not get through....... Nothing is going to change.

I remember operating portable 9K2 while deployed to the combat theater 
in 2002. The Russian & European QRM was unbelieveable, and almost 
intolerable at times. However I politely told them to "stand by for USA" 
and didn't get upset at all. I did not put anyone on a no QSL list. In 
fact, when I returned stateside, I send every USA station a card at my 
own expense. I didn't care how many times they called on top of the 
station I was trying to work.

73,

John, W4NU
(K4JAG 1959 to 1998)

------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:24:24 -0600
From: "Roy" <royanjoy at ncn.net>
Subject: Re: Topband: metal enclosure
To: <topband at contesting.com>
Message-ID: <36E5D98A23A14E408DDBB9B945B2D93D at RoyPC>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
	reply-type=original

"I am totally reworking the feed system on my Inv-L... I have decided that I

would like to use a large metal enclosure depending on cost. I need 
something about 20"L x 16"W x 8"D. Anyone have a good source or a better 
idea ?"

Mail box?

73,   Roy      K6XK

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:35:29 -0600
From: "Doug Renwick" <ve5ra at sasktel.net>
Subject: Re: Topband: Interference on 160
To: "'John Harden'" <jhdmd at bellsouth.net>, <topband at contesting.com>
Message-ID: <925C9EED4EF74B4A8948B928B9748AAF at DOUG5HP>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="US-ASCII"

Great if you can do it.  But on the flip side it condones and encourages bad
behaviour which may be part of the problem.  In any sport there is a referee
who catches and penalizes bad behaviour.  Otherwise the game may get out of
control.  You are the referee.

Doug

>-----Original Message-----
>
>I remember operating portable 9K2 while deployed to the combat theater
>in 2002. The Russian & European QRM was unbelieveable, and almost
>intolerable at times. However I politely told them to "stand by for USA"
>and didn't get upset at all. I did not put anyone on a no QSL list. In
>fact, when I returned stateside, I send every USA station a card at my
>own expense. I didn't care how many times they called on top of the
>station I was trying to work.
>
>73,
>
>John, W4NU
>(K4JAG 1959 to 1998)

------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 09:57:44 -0500
From: "Chet" <chetmoore at cox.net>
Subject: Re: Topband: My First DX
To: "'Jerry Keller \(K3BZ\)'" <k3bz at verizon.net>,	"'\(REFLECTOR\)
	Topband'" <topband at contesting.com>
Message-ID: <00a101ccd84d$0884bce0$198e36a0$@net>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"

Hey Jerry,

Sorry to hear about the 160 dx.  It is addictive. Recommend you seek
counseling and get into a 12 step program immediately <grin>  My first 160
dx was when I shorted both legs of my 80 meter dipole to give  K4PQL (now
N4AF)
A qso in the 160m contest  qso and ended up working few other PVRC'ers and a
VP9.

73

Chet N4FX

-----Original Message-----
From: topband-bounces at contesting.com [mailto:topband-bounces at contesting.com]
On Behalf Of Jerry Keller (K3BZ)
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 11:44 PM
To: (REFLECTOR) Topband
Subject: Topband: My First DX

Pardon my exuberance, but I worked my very first Topband DX this evening...
PJ4C on Bonaire. Me happy.

73, Jerry K3BZ
_______________________________________________
UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK

------------------------------

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End of Topband Digest, Vol 109, Issue 36
****************************************