Topband: Top Band and JT65
k8bhz at alphacomm.net
k8bhz at alphacomm.net
Sun May 21 16:47:21 EDT 2017
Very well said Mark, thank you.
On 5/21/2017 4:29 PM, Mark K3MSB wrote:
> The issue is not one of any mode being more "valid" that the other,
> nor is it one of a QSO being "valid" or "invalid" based upon the
> mode. If a two way exchange is completed between two legally
> licensed amateur stations using lawfully authorized modes, the QSO is
> valid. I think it's that simple.
> But that's not what I had brought up in my post of several days
> ago. The issue I brought up is that of a level playing field for
> competition / award purposes.
> Modes that require a computer to effect a QSO should be in a different
> category than modes that do not. By "require" I do not mean "make
> easier", but rather could not be accomplished without a computer.
> My ICOM makes a QSO easier than my ARC-5s, but both still need a
> human's skill to complete the QSO. Stated alternately, modes that
> requires a human skill should be categorized differently than those
> that do not -- and by human skill I do not mean downloading software
> and pushing buttons. As someone pointed out, the DXCC rules are not
> part of the 10 commandments. It is my opinion that technology has
> reached a new level in which the rules need to be changed to
> accommodate that level.
> The same is true of remote operations. I can whip out my credit
> card and use a station on the west coat and get my 5 remaining zones
> on 80 to complete my 5BWAZ. I will not do that as I feel it is
> unsportsmanlike to do so. Are the QSOs legal as per the rules? Yes
> (unless CQ has changed them recently). But, to my way of thinking,
> the journey is an important part of getting to the destination.
> This issue is not about validating someone's worth as a "real
> amateur" (no code, know code, extra light etc), but rather
> recognizing that human skill in achieving a goal should be treated
> differently than letting a computer alone achieve the same goal that
> requires no such skill.
> There is nothing wrong with the JT modes; they are a wonderful
> advancement in communications technology in the spirit of the
> advancement of amateur radio. But in the light of competition based
> upon human striving and skill, they are in a different category.
> They are not good or bad, they are not valid or invalid; they are
> just different. Technology has moved on to the point where the
> existing rules need to be changed.
> Mark K3MSB
> On May 21, 2017 6:20 AM, "Mike va3mw" <va3mw at portcredit.net
> <mailto:va3mw at portcredit.net>> wrote:
> Glenn nailed it.
> If you don't like it, don't use it. No one is forcing anyone to
> It is really that simple.
> Mike va3mw
> > On May 21, 2017, at 6:09 AM, Glenn Wyant <va3dx at sympatico.ca
> <mailto:va3dx at sympatico.ca>> wrote:
> > If an amateur has interest in psk, jt65 etc or EME, cw or any band
> > or mode; it is not for us to judge his particular interests.
> > VA3DX
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: <k8bhz at alphacomm.net
> <mailto:k8bhz at alphacomm.net>>
> > To: <Topband at contesting.com <mailto:Topband at contesting.com>>
> > Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2017 11:47 PM
> > Subject: Re: Topband: Top Band and JT65
> >> Promised myself I'd stay out of this, but it's getting
> ridiculous....Comments like "I worked 20 new ones on 160, and I
> never heard any of them!". Wow! That's amazing...I personally
> can't find any satisfaction in claiming a contact I never heard. I
> never have...Yes, the digi modes allow easier qso's that would
> never have been made, but let's face it, you never made those
> contacts, your computer & it's software did. Any resulting
> "Awards" should be made out to your computer. Meteor scatter used
> to be very popular, actually getting to hear the excited voices of
> those you worked was thrilling. One m/s qso of mine was with a yl
> from the Carolinas with a most delightful Southern accent...hard
> to duplicate with digi modes. I don't know anyone who works or
> talks about rocks anymore....no challenge. Same with eme, which I
> pulled the plug on when it was no longer a challenge. How many new
> eme operators have heard their own voices coming back from the
> moon? I migrated to TopBand as
> one of the last real challenges left....
> >> I find the litany of excuses about why one has to go to digital
> means on 160 to be feeble at best." My rig can't cut it, I don't
> have the antennas, I can't copy code (one of the real elephants in
> the room!), my location isn't on the coast where it's easy, etc,
> etc". There are MANY dxers operating successfully on small lots,
> and there are a myriad of clever, small receiving antennas out
> there. How about the gentleman on the left coast who worked DXCC
> on 160 from his mobile!! (without digital modes).
> >> My TopBand rig is quite modest, no towers or rotors. The TX
> antennas are wires hanging from trees with no more than 50'
> vertical rise. The 16 radials under each are only 48' long.
> Desperately needing a new rig, I bought the very cheapest HF
> transceiver on the market (no DSP, keyer, antenna tuner, etc). My
> location in Upper Michigan is not near either coast for "easy" dx,
> but is unfortunately close to the auroral oval. My amp was a
> non-working "gift" that doesn't run full power. However, I have
> 233 countries & 37 zones confirmed on 160. I have personally HEARD
> every qso made & have decoded them as necessary, in my HEAD. I
> don't spot myself or arrange skeds....I don't have a computer in
> the shack.
> >> If ham radio was to go all digital, I would walk away from
> it....Not because I'm a curmudgeon, but simply because the
> challenge and resulting thrills would be gone.
> >> Lest you think I am a ignorant technophobe, I am a degreed
> electrical engineer and have been a ham for over 60 years. I have
> a fine computer & am on it actively every day....but I never
> pretend that it's ham radio.
> >> I realize from the comment below that it's rather boring to
> work digi modes, but I suspect that help is on the way....I am
> truly surprised that no one has produced an "app" that will take
> the remaining work out of it. You would simply download the app,
> check the appropriate boxes (DXCC, WAS, WAZ), select the desired
> bands, and turn it loose 24 hours a day. It would make all the
> contacts for you (with similar robo-stations) and send you a text
> or email when it's through. Heck, it could even apply for your
> desired awards, and then wake up your printer to print your award
> certificate out! It would then send another message to pick up
> your award....How truly exciting that would be.
> >> Brian K8BHZ
> >> 2017 12:39 AM, DXer wrote:
> >>> >>>To me, just not the challenge of dxing mostly cw and ssb.
> >>> Fair enough. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
> >>> Another angle. I find JT65 to be a very relaxing mode. Which
> other mode allows one to read and write emails, go get a coffee,
> answer 'nature's call', etc. while making contacts? Timing is
> important, but doable. :^)
> >>> 73 de Vince, VA3VF
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