George,
1) VHF Contests are merely an adjunct activity to the daily experience. I
don't fire up my station just to keep in "tune for the contest season". I
actively work on improving the NF of my preamps, adjusting feedline losses,
improving antennas... the litany of stuff that's oh-so common in all phases
of activity. However, the SOLE reason for these improvements is NOT to
contest.
2) Many of these captive rovers are, indeed, using odd-ball equipment that
was designed and constructed MANY years ago. Since I don't have an unlimited
pot of cash, I'm not going to attempt replicating this gear solely to work
these stations. With the advances in technology, this should be fading out
like the dinosaur - as using COTS transverters somewhat assures
interoperability. In fairness, if something works - why change it? For
instance Gunnplexer 10GHz transceivers using a 10.7MHz IF. The more recent
standard (like ARR made)was a 30MHz IF. These can't talk to one another.
Thus, if I have BOTH - I can work BOTH types. Not having one has cost me
QSOs in the past. Does that make it unethical? I doubt it.
3) Many rovers begin practically "captive" in the beginning. If there's no
big gun station for them to try for, often times these minimal stations
can't or DON'T hear much other activity to play with. And, frankly, much of
the gear is begged/borrowed/stolen. When I borrow something, I take extra
good care of it, to the point of almost OBSESSION. That could imply ENSURING
a QSO with those who lent it to you. I'd think that's an honorable thing to
do. Call it what you will.
4) I'm a Top-10er SOHP station, and reside in an area where we have no less
than 2 M/M stations, 4-7 full-band rovers, and lots of smaller stations
available. Any rover in this area that does NOT work others gets severely
smacked. I expect that, unless there are mitigating circumstances (read #2,
#3) or they are just complete JACKASSES - they will work what they hear.
5) Since you've NO experience above 900MHz, you can't understand WHY it can
take 20 minutes or longer to complete a QSO on 2GHz, then another 20 on
3GHz, then another on 5GHz, then another on 10GHz - then 25 minutes on
24GHz. This kind of time eats into rover schedules, and sometimes can
seriously impact their ability to work others. If I chew up even 30 minutes
of a rovers time in a certain grid, that kills a LOT of QSOs for others. WHY
does this happen? Because we've spent the time, energy and effort to BUILD
these bands. That's part of the innovation on VHF+. WE don't just build
stations for points - we do it for MANY reasons other than that. VUCC,
distance records... you name it. And making the $$ per QSO ratio come down
is certainly a factor.
6) The example you cite, once you build your station to include more bands,
will likely follow the SAME example. How many other 10-band stations reside
in STX for the rovers to work? You don't INTEND for a rover to be captive
when you help get them going, but unless others in your region follow suit
and build up their stations to take advantage of it - you will be the only
QSO for them. Hey - is THAT cheating? Nope. It's a sign of laziness or lack
of effort - not a criticism of method.
Stations like W2SZ, W2FU, K8GP, K3EAR, W3CCX, KM0T, K2AXX, K1TEO, W3RJW et
al use rovers to their advantage. ND3F, N2JMH, W3IY, VE3NPB, N1MU, K2LDT,
N2LBT et al - these guys all make a SIGNIFICANT effort to work each of the
biggies. Yeah, they have time pressures. They want to maximize the effort
they put forth. However, I work them all (when I find them) and bitch when I
don't. That's contesting competitiveness at its raw form. If I miss N1MU in
a grid, that hurts my score (especially if I know that K1TEO worked them!).
My rover percentage has been VERY high (about 35% of the log) for the past
couple years. SO what?
If a station chooses to work only ONE of these guys, that's their
PEROGATIVE. Saying its UNETHICAL MAY be appropriate (unless the cases where
#2 and #3 apply) ONLY IF it is expressed as a choice. If I hear the guy,
call them and get NO answer - that SUCKS. But, you need to remember George -
on many hilltops there's a LOT of crap that can block me (intermod, other
hills, etc). If I don't have a big enough station to get their attention,
that COULD be a factor.
I'm not defending the Jackasses that, for some reason, will ONLY work a
"mothership" because that's generally detremental to the hobby. Numbers and
statistical analysis only prove its existence. Practical experience tells
you "of COURSE it can happen". Once you get there, I think this issue will
become a bit more understandable.
-Mark, K2AXX
-----Original Message-----
From: George Fremin III [mailto:geoiii@kkn.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 3:59 PM
To: vhfcontesting@contesting.com
Subject: [VHFcontesting] captive rovers
Based on some of the comments I have seen posted on this subject
recently (and in the past) it is clear to me that many do not
understand the issue of captive rovers.
I am going to make an attempt at an example of why I think this sort
of activity is not in the spirit of the contest and how it can be used
to make a very big score.
In the June 2003 VHF contest my station was in the limited multi-op
category. Our score looked like this:
Band QSOs Points Mults
50 1128 1128 254
144 130 130 35
222 22 44 15
432 34 68 16
903 0
1.2 0
2.4 0
3.4 0
5.6 0
10 0
Totals 1314 1370 320
Total score 438,400
I do not yet have any bands above 432 Mhz but I would like to add them
as money and time permit.
If my station were geared up for all the bands up through 10 Ghz and
we were also build up one rover that could get on those 10 bands we
could work the rover in 9 grids - this would assure we got all 9 grids
as mults on all 10 bands and also got 9 contacts on those 10 bands we
would also get 90 more contacts. If this rover did not work anyone
else this would be 90 contacts that no one else could get - it would
also be many mults that those folks would not get either since most of
these grids are not active on many bands.
So the rover would go to these grids:
DM91 EM01 EM11
DM90 EM00 EM10
DL99 EL09 EL19
My station is in EM00.
Our score would now look like this:
Band QSOs Points Mults
50 1138 1138 254
144 139 139 35
222 31 62 15
432 43 86 16
903 9 27 9
1.2 9 27 9
2.4 9 36 9
3.4 9 36 9
5.6 9 36 9
10 9 36 9
Totals 1405 1623 374
Total score 607,002
Quite a big increase in score for working just one station and the best
part is that this rover does not work anyone else on these bands so our
competitors will not get any of these 90 contacts nor most of the mults.
Now if we get four more rover setups to go to those same 9 girds with 10
bands each
we can produce a score like this:
Band QSOs Points Mults
50 1173 1173 254
144 175 175 35
222 67 134 15
432 79 158 16
903 45 135 9
1.2 45 135 9
2.4 45 180 9
3.4 45 180 9
5.6 45 180 9
10 45 180 9
Totals 1764 2630 374
Total score 983,620
I think it is worth pointing out that this increase is from only 4
additional rovers and without working any new multipliers.
The striking thing to me is that it does not take too many contacts to
to increase the score a large amount.
Now lets take this one step further - we will build up some
transverters that are of a simple design that work on 2.4, 3.4 and 5.6
Ghz. We will also build up some tri band dishes. These setups will
only require a 2m FM HT as an IF. They will not put out very much
power.
Lets build 5 of these and recruit 5 more operators that have cars and
2m handheld radios. We will then give them directions to the four
locations that are at the grid corner that is about 10 miles from my
QTH. We will work them on these three band plus 146 and 440 since
each of them have dual band FM mobiles in their cars. So we get to
work five rovers in four grids for 20 more contacts per band.
This will take our score to: 1,095,820
Now do this five more times so our score would now be this: 1,208,020
As you can see the contest becomes a race to see how many guys you can
get on to work just you on these high point value bands.
Maybe now you will understand why this might be a problem.
If there were a group out there that had been doing this
in vhf contests for years what would you think of their efforts?
--
George Fremin III - K5TR
geoiii@kkn.net
http://www.kkn.net/~k5tr
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